TPS slew rate for Accel shot tuning?

Questions specific to Megatunix - alternate tuning software that runs on unix and windows.
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TPS slew rate for Accel shot tuning?

Postby pinzgauer » Thu Feb 19, 2009 7:53 am

While on the "it would be nice", anyone know how to get a view of the TPS slew rate?

IE: you set the accel shot by specifying how much at a given slew rate. I've not seen an easy way to watch the slew rates real time while trying to tune accel shots. So it's (literal) a shot in the dark on the volts/sec settings. I'm currently investigating TPSdot to see if that's a useful indicator.

I'd love to see a slider or dial showing TPS slew rate, with a "sticky" indicator showing peak for a few seconds. Would be really nice to have that & ego error on the bottom of the accel shot page. If not a slider, just an numeric variable indicator showing the last TPS slew rate used. Have it time out after N seconds, or replaced by the next accel shot.

Best I've been able to come up with so far is to look at the data logs after the fact. Any suggestions?

have fun,

Alan
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Re: TPS slew rate for Accel shot tuning?

Postby djandruczyk » Thu Feb 19, 2009 9:08 am

pinzgauer wrote:While on the "it would be nice", anyone know how to get a view of the TPS slew rate?

IE: you set the accel shot by specifying how much at a given slew rate. I've not seen an easy way to watch the slew rates real time while trying to tune accel shots. So it's (literal) a shot in the dark on the volts/sec settings. I'm currently investigating TPSdot to see if that's a useful indicator.

I'd love to see a slider or dial showing TPS slew rate, with a "sticky" indicator showing peak for a few seconds. Would be really nice to have that & ego error on the bottom of the accel shot page. If not a slider, just an numeric variable indicator showing the last TPS slew rate used. Have it time out after N seconds, or replaced by the next accel shot.

Best I've been able to come up with so far is to look at the data logs after the fact. Any suggestions?

have fun,

Alan


Both are on my todo list. the slider with peak/hold (like megatune's runtime screen) and a TPSdot/MAPdot gauge for the accel wizard. Basicaly the slider will bethe display, the tps/mapdot calc is a little tricky as it requires a conditional, which my math parser unfortunately doesn't do, but I should be able to find a way around it sooner or later...
David J. Andruczyk
MegaTunix author. The only non-java cross platform tuning software for MS-I/II hardware.
Where to get and how to install:
http://msextra.com/viewtopic.php?t=23080
http://sourceforge.net/projects/megatunix
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Re: TPS slew rate for Accel shot tuning?

Postby pinzgauer » Thu Feb 19, 2009 9:37 am

djandruczyk wrote: the slider with peak/hold (like megatune's runtime screen) and a TPSdot/MAPdot gauge for the accel wizard. Basicaly the slider will bethe display, the tps/mapdot calc is a little tricky as it requires a conditional, which my math parser unfortunately doesn't do, but I should be able to find a way around it sooner or later...


Cool, this would be a great help. Main issue I have is I can't tell when I'm hitting which v/s bin. So don't know which param to adjust except by trial & error. kpa mode in extra is a little easier to adjust, but less responsive.

Have fun, and thanks for all the effort in mtx!

Alan
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Re: TPS slew rate for Accel shot tuning?

Postby djandruczyk » Fri Oct 09, 2009 1:03 pm

pinzgauer wrote:
djandruczyk wrote: the slider with peak/hold (like megatune's runtime screen) and a TPSdot/MAPdot gauge for the accel wizard. Basicaly the slider will bethe display, the tps/mapdot calc is a little tricky as it requires a conditional, which my math parser unfortunately doesn't do, but I should be able to find a way around it sooner or later...


Cool, this would be a great help. Main issue I have is I can't tell when I'm hitting which v/s bin. So don't know which param to adjust except by trial & error. kpa mode in extra is a little easier to adjust, but less responsive.

Have fun, and thanks for all the effort in mtx!

Alan



This is done, completed and working on 0.9.19-beta1 on the accel wizard tabs. (for MS2-at least, which provides a TPSdot variable).
David J. Andruczyk
MegaTunix author. The only non-java cross platform tuning software for MS-I/II hardware.
Where to get and how to install:
http://msextra.com/viewtopic.php?t=23080
http://sourceforge.net/projects/megatunix
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Re: TPS slew rate for Accel shot tuning?

Postby pinzgauer » Mon Nov 14, 2016 6:55 am

That will be a great addition. From memory, only megatune & megatunix have that now. (I like the megatunix approach) If it's in TS I could not find it.

Until you get a tpsdot widget you can calculate it using the logs. Add TPS ADC counts to your log viewer. Log some typical TPS movements (fast and slow). Expand your log out to maximum resolution. It's not hard to use the scale slider to measure at about .1 sec granularity

Let's say no throttle was 10 adc counts, and WOT it's 180. So from idle to floored would be 170 counts.

Now figure out your volt swing: 170counts * (5v /255 counts) =3.3v

Now divide by the time from the log it took to make the swing. Let's say it did it in .5 sec. 3.3v / 0.5sec= 6.6 V/sec

If you log several attempts you can figure out your likely max slew rate. Make your top accel bin just above that. (In the example above I'd probably pick 8v/sec.

Most throttle movements are smaller, so I use more granularity in the smaller ones. So in the example above I'd probably set the third bin at 4v/s. And the the first & second at 1 & 2 respectively.

So you'd end up with 1,2,4,8 as your V/sec bins. (The binary exponential sequence was just accidental in this example). MS will interpolate, so the exact sequence does not have to be linear.

You can do the same with map, just add map adc counts to your log.

Map often has a bit more delay to it, so it moves a bit slower.

Most throttle movements are small, so start tuning there first. Likewise, many folks overestimate the max slew rates.

Without a tpsdot indicator the logs and by ear are about the only way to tune this. If your o2 sensor is fast you can see the effect when it goes lean and then recovers. But there is normally a bit of delay in the o2 sensor, so you almost have to go by ear.

Even if you have a tpsdot indicator it's still useful to log some driving and see what some typical and maximum throttle movements are
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Re: TPS slew rate for Accel shot tuning?

Postby jsmcortina » Mon Nov 14, 2016 8:07 am

I'm not sure what you think you are missing? TunerStudio has a more helpful AE screen. The other two softwares are obsolete and unsupported.

James
I can supply, repair or upgrade Megasquirts in UK. http://www.jamesmurrayengineering.co.uk

My Success story: viewtopic.php?f=104&t=34277
MSEXTRA documentation at: http://www.msextra.com/doc/index.html
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Re: TPS slew rate for Accel shot tuning?

Postby pinzgauer » Mon Nov 14, 2016 3:03 pm

jsmcortina wrote:I'm not sure what you think you are missing? TunerStudio has a more helpful AE screen. The other two softwares are obsolete and unsupported.


Realtime TPS Dot display that also has a functioning AFR gauge in sight. Megatunix allows that. The gauges keep working even as you use the tuning screens/wizards. As does the runtime window and the Engine Status panel.

If TS has that capability that I've have missed it.

By the way, while Megatunix is not publicly supported by it's author, that does not mean that it's completely abandoned. I have made and may continue to make updates to it that I may merge back into the source and make available in binary form. There are a couple of items I'm working on fixing and will try to get that back in as a stable baseline.

But ultimately, this thread was about Megadroid. An Accel wizard with real time TPSDot/MapDot + an AFR readout would be most useful!
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Re: TPS slew rate for Accel shot tuning?

Postby jsmcortina » Mon Nov 14, 2016 3:11 pm

pinzgauer wrote:
jsmcortina wrote:I'm not sure what you think you are missing? TunerStudio has a more helpful AE screen. The other two softwares are obsolete and unsupported.


Realtime TPS Dot display that also has a functioning AFR gauge in sight. Megatunix allows that. The gauges keep working even as you use the tuning screens/wizards. As does the runtime window and the Engine Status panel.

They do in TS unless you've turned them off by using "Modal" dialogues.

James
I can supply, repair or upgrade Megasquirts in UK. http://www.jamesmurrayengineering.co.uk

My Success story: viewtopic.php?f=104&t=34277
MSEXTRA documentation at: http://www.msextra.com/doc/index.html
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Re: TPS slew rate for Accel shot tuning?

Postby pinzgauer » Mon Nov 14, 2016 3:26 pm

jsmcortina wrote:
pinzgauer wrote:They do in TS unless you've turned them off by using "Modal" dialogues.


Interesting, I don't think I've turned anything off in TS. I'll take a look and give it a try. Thanks!

Edit: I see live gauges option for VE table (Options | View), but not for AE Wizard. I'll try tomorrow live and see if it changes anything live.
Edit2: I see the AFR in the image in the tuning manual, so it must only activate when live, etc. Looks very useful if it's like the image! I'll give it a try!

Image
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