Hi Gear MPG Gauge

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Re: Hi Gear MPG Gauge

Postby Silverback » Thu Jun 19, 2014 12:28 am

working without GPS input? I see all the options under trip economy but they don't seem to work and I was under the impression that they required GPS input.
Mark -- aka: WS6 TA, JYDog, 83 Crossfire TA, mpikas, mmp...
MS2 Extra | PCB 3 | HEI Mod | TPI harness Adapter | AEM UEGO wideband | 87 Trans Am | 305TPI | T5 transmission - pretty close to stock
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Re: Hi Gear MPG Gauge

Postby LT401Vette » Wed Jun 25, 2014 5:57 am

You can use the Power and economy fields without GPS. There are a couple ways.

if you have a MegaSquirt with some other Speed Input like on an MS3

Also if you have added one to your MS1 or MS2 using one of the spare ADC's and appropriate circuit. Then you need to crate an OutputChannel in a custom.ini named userSpeedMPH , that is case sensitive. DO what ever calculations you need to make that field equal to the speed in MPH.

The userSpeedMPH can be used with a straight calculation based on RPM also, with the obvious limitations (Only right in 1 gear, automatic converter slippage, etc) I have seen some people use calculations to guess the gear and have it work in other gears too.
Phil Tobin
EFI Analytics, helping to simplify EFI
Next Generation tuning software.
Supporting all MegaSquirt versions and firmwares.
http://www.TunerStudio.com
http://www.efiAnalytics.com/MegaLogViewer/
Support the firmware running your engine:
http://www.msextra.com/doc/donations.html
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Re: Hi Gear MPG Gauge

Postby Silverback » Sat Jun 28, 2014 12:54 pm

huh, since I have an '87 Pontiac TA with a digital dash I know that I have a VSS signal somewhere, I guess I need to find it, figure out the format and then figure out how to get it into the MS... I wonder if the original ECM had a VSS input on it, if it did then it's already in the harness even, I just need to get it wired to something that the TPI adapter has wired to a spare pin and then wire that to an open adc...

Phil (or anyone else), do you know if the GM VSS signal (either before or after the buffer box) can be fed straight into the MS without modifying it? Is there a channel that is customarily (or recommended) used for a VSS input on an MS?
Mark -- aka: WS6 TA, JYDog, 83 Crossfire TA, mpikas, mmp...
MS2 Extra | PCB 3 | HEI Mod | TPI harness Adapter | AEM UEGO wideband | 87 Trans Am | 305TPI | T5 transmission - pretty close to stock
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Re: Hi Gear MPG Gauge

Postby Silverback » Sun Jun 29, 2014 10:48 am

LT401Vette wrote:You can use the Power and economy fields without GPS. There are a couple ways.

if you have a MegaSquirt with some other Speed Input like on an MS3

Also if you have added one to your MS1 or MS2 using one of the spare ADC's and appropriate circuit. Then you need to crate an OutputChannel in a custom.ini named userSpeedMPH , that is case sensitive. DO what ever calculations you need to make that field equal to the speed in MPH.

The userSpeedMPH can be used with a straight calculation based on RPM also, with the obvious limitations (Only right in 1 gear, automatic converter slippage, etc) I have seen some people use calculations to guess the gear and have it work in other gears too.


Phil, I spent a few hours googling and reading last night and honestly, I'm no futher along then I was yesterday. If you can point me at some reasonably clear instructions for this I'm sure I can figure it out, otherwise if you could give some details it would be very helpful. I ran across this for MS1 extra (I'm using MS2, so I don't know if it's all applicable), and I believe that you may have even been involved in writing it, but after reading it half a dozen times or more I can't seem to make any sense of the instructions:
http://www.msextra.com/doc/ms1extra/MS_ ... m#addgauge

I guess right now I'm thinking
  1. figure out how to define a userSpeedMPH channel (I'm hoping that I'm using the correct terminology) based on rpm just to get the guage working
  2. figure out if I really damaged my JS4, thread here no real answer: viewtopic.php?f=132&t=54563&p=404131#p404131
  3. figure out what it will take to bring the VSS signal in on JS4 and then redefine userSpeedMPH based on that (I suspect that this might be quite a bit of work since I think that VSS output might be a frequency, need to find out)

Issues/what I don't understand in the above linked instructions (again, if you know of better ones I'd appreciate a link):
  • it looks like it expects you to make the custom.ini based on the msns-extra.ini
    • I'm not sure if it's just using the msns-extra.ini as an example or if your supposed to start with it and modify it
    • is the custom.ini a copy of that file with your modifications or does it just contain the lines necessary/that you're adding and modifies the .ini file running when you run TS?
    • is the msns-extra.ini file the appropriate file to start with for an MS2extra setup? I don't even appear to have a current copy of it in the directory shown in the picture (well \ProgramFiles (x86) since I'm running on x64 Win8)
  • What is the relivance of timeroll in those instructions?
  • can I use one term to define another, can I literally just put something like:
    userSpeedMph = { ((Rpm / 3.08) * 7.08 / 5280 ) * 60 }
Mark -- aka: WS6 TA, JYDog, 83 Crossfire TA, mpikas, mmp...
MS2 Extra | PCB 3 | HEI Mod | TPI harness Adapter | AEM UEGO wideband | 87 Trans Am | 305TPI | T5 transmission - pretty close to stock
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Re: Hi Gear MPG Gauge

Postby Brian H EFI » Tue Jul 01, 2014 9:41 am

Silverback

I have attached a custom.ini file that will take the the raw adc and covert it to MPH
based on what speed you are traveling at when the VSS speed circuit is reading 2.5v.

Also here is a link to the circuit you need to convert the frequency to a 0 - 5 signal.
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=49710

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Re: Hi Gear MPG Gauge

Postby Silverback » Wed Jul 02, 2014 12:15 pm

Thank you Brian!

that little bit there explains more than probably >5hrs of googling and reading did or the article that I found.

Can you explain some of the formatting/terms? Have you found it listed somewhere/does the formatting follow some standard that I can look up (to be honest, besides some simple scripting I haven't done any programming or anything related since... well maybe the early 90's...)?

Are the terms/variables/whatever they are called that are predefined/used by TS listed somewhere (things like userSpeedMph)?

If I'm reading correctly:
- the first (Speed) line is just setting a value that can be easy adjusted/human readable to use in the next line
- I'm guessing that in the second line the " adc? < 1 ? 0 " means something like if adc? is less than 1 then set mph to 0, the : is just a separator and then the second part only gets done if it's >1?
Mark -- aka: WS6 TA, JYDog, 83 Crossfire TA, mpikas, mmp...
MS2 Extra | PCB 3 | HEI Mod | TPI harness Adapter | AEM UEGO wideband | 87 Trans Am | 305TPI | T5 transmission - pretty close to stock
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Re: Hi Gear MPG Gauge

Postby Brian H EFI » Fri Jul 04, 2014 7:16 am

There are some constants or variables like userSpeedMph that are preset in TunerStudio but most
constants and all PcVariables are not preset.

That is correct the variable Speed is used to calibrate the readings from the sensor then mphTemp
is used to calculate your actual MPH. userSpeedMPH is a set variable in TunerStudio that is used
for the trip / Economy gauges.

Yes that part of the expression is used just to make sure the gauge will fall to 0.

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Re: Hi Gear MPG Gauge

Postby R100RT » Sun Aug 10, 2014 3:57 pm

LT401Vette wrote:The MPG gauge (along with power, tq, fuel flow, etc) is in the current stable release of TS.


Is it true that the above features only work with MS3?
Is there applicability for Microsquirt on MS2Extra?
1983 BMW R100RT Bike
Turbocharged - Water Injection
Sequential Ignition is great
"Perky Sleeper"
New toy - 1995 BMW K75 is on "The Mod Table", another V2 vintage Microsquirt kit'n caboodle ready to add, turbocharger in process, all the "usual suspects"
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Re: Hi Gear MPG Gauge

Postby LT401Vette » Mon Aug 11, 2014 7:15 am

Is it true that the above features only work with MS3?
Is there applicability for Microsquirt on MS2Extra?


It will work with MS1, 2 or 3. But you need some form of speed input. That is where MS3 is easiest because it has speed input readily available.

With MS1 or MS2 you can either use GPS for speed input, or use a spare ADC to provide input from a VSS.
If you use a spare ADC you will need to make a speed sensor circuit, there is one outlined in the MS1 Extra manuals:
http://www.msextra.com/doc/ms1extra/antirev.html

If using a GPS for input speed, a regular low speed GPS will work for fuel economy, but for HP you will want a high speed GPS. Something like this 10Hz:
https://www.efianalytics.com/products/BT-Q818XT.html
Phil Tobin
EFI Analytics, helping to simplify EFI
Next Generation tuning software.
Supporting all MegaSquirt versions and firmwares.
http://www.TunerStudio.com
http://www.efiAnalytics.com/MegaLogViewer/
Support the firmware running your engine:
http://www.msextra.com/doc/donations.html
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Re: Hi Gear MPG Gauge

Postby R100RT » Mon Aug 11, 2014 11:35 am

Thanks Phil, crystal clear as per your usual assistance.
Regards,

Lorne.
1983 BMW R100RT Bike
Turbocharged - Water Injection
Sequential Ignition is great
"Perky Sleeper"
New toy - 1995 BMW K75 is on "The Mod Table", another V2 vintage Microsquirt kit'n caboodle ready to add, turbocharger in process, all the "usual suspects"
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Re: Hi Gear MPG Gauge

Postby M30guy » Thu Sep 28, 2017 7:12 pm

LT401Vette wrote:What has been on my todo list for years now, but I think I have all the ground work in place finally to do it. Make a tool to measure injector open time.
The high level plan is to make a wizard sort, where the engine is held at about a 2000 RPM free spin. The ve's for the run range get altered up and down slightly. By taking measurements of the delta PW and delta AFR, a effective one time could be measured. An engineering approach, but could give a much better open time to use in the tune settings and be used for calculating better net pw's.



hey lt401vette i've been out of the loop for some years when it comes to MS have you made this tool already?
can't find anything about it so probably not. been 7yrs :shock:
Win10. Ms2-3.2.4 v3.0 .
Turbo BMW m30b35.
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Re: Hi Gear MPG Gauge

Postby LT401Vette » Fri Sep 29, 2017 8:19 pm

Right Click on a gauge and look under "Trip / Economy"
You will also want to check the settings for them under the main menu:
Data Logging --> Performance and Economy
Phil Tobin
EFI Analytics, helping to simplify EFI
Next Generation tuning software.
Supporting all MegaSquirt versions and firmwares.
http://www.TunerStudio.com
http://www.efiAnalytics.com/MegaLogViewer/
Support the firmware running your engine:
http://www.msextra.com/doc/donations.html
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Re: Hi Gear MPG Gauge

Postby M30guy » Sat Sep 30, 2017 6:00 pm

oh i was talking about the wizard for injector dead time autotune i thought that was what you where talking about.
Win10. Ms2-3.2.4 v3.0 .
Turbo BMW m30b35.
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Re: Hi Gear MPG Gauge

Postby LT401Vette » Sun Oct 01, 2017 3:12 pm

M30guy wrote:oh i was talking about the wizard for injector dead time autotune i thought that was what you where talking about.


In a High Gear MPG Gauge thread from 3 years ago?
Phil Tobin
EFI Analytics, helping to simplify EFI
Next Generation tuning software.
Supporting all MegaSquirt versions and firmwares.
http://www.TunerStudio.com
http://www.efiAnalytics.com/MegaLogViewer/
Support the firmware running your engine:
http://www.msextra.com/doc/donations.html
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