Can I use Shadowdash and tune simultaneously?

[KW78]

Hi all,

I am installing a MS3x (DIYAuto pre-assembled) in a miata race car, and we are using an amazon Kindle as a dash display using Shadowdash. I bought the hardwired cable for the RS232 to micro USB connection.

I do not have this running yet, however we got the MS3x talking to the laptop last night.

I have realized I am going to run into a problem if I can not use the RS232 output and the USB "B plug" output at the same time, and if memory serves the manual says you can not.

I would like to be able to tune the car on the dyno without disabling the dash.

ALSO I would like to put the bluetooth adapter on it at the track (or permanently) to make changes more rapidly because sessions/track time are often very limited.

IDEALLY I would like to get a USB B to USB micro cable to run the Kindle Dash, and put the RS232 bluetooth adapter on the RS232 port and continue.

Will this work? If not, any suggestions on how to at least tune without disconnecting dash?

Thanks in advance!
Kyle
Sector Purple Racing.

[racingmini_mtl]

You cannot connect more than one device to the MS3 serial port whether it is through an RS232, USB or Bluetooth interface. The only way to tune the MS3 while still having a dash would be to have one of those (or both) connected to the CAN bus.

Jean

[KW78]

Thanks for the reply Jean,

Hmm.. OK.

I am totally unfamiliar with using the CAN bus. I am aware of its theory but that is about it, I have never implemented any install using it (although I am ready to learn!)

(On a personal race car using MS2, I also have race capture which has CAN communications to pull in all the MS parameters into its logfile/telemetry stream.... A goal this winter to work out)

How would I get the bluetooth on the can bus? I did a brief forum search here with no results. Is there any how-to article I can start with? Or some overview advice?

Thanks,
Kyle
SPR

[racingmini_mtl]

Actually, it's a bit more complicated than that. You need a device that will translate the serial protocol to the CAN protocol. And the only devices that understand the MS serial protocol and the MS CAN protocol are MS devices and MS-compatible devices.

The latest TinyIOx code allows this to be done in theory but I have not tested it extensively. Also this testing was done using a USB-serial adapter but using a Bluetooth interface should also be possible. That would mean you would need to connect the TinyIOx to the MS3 over the CAN bus (you just need 2 wires: CANH and CANL) and you could put the TinyIOx inside the MS3 case and power it from the MS3 5V supply. You would then need to connect a Bluetooth adapter (either a 5V TTL or an RS232 version) to the TinyIOx serial port.

Once those connections are done, for tuning you would simply communicate with the MS3 from your PC using TunerStudio and selecting the Bluetooth adapter as your serial connection. The fact that it would go through the TinyIOx would be completely transparent. This is what we call CAN passthrough. One thing to note is that you cannot do a firmware update over CAN so you would need to use the actual MS3 serial port for this and disconnect your dash display.

However, as I said I haven't done extensive testing and no testing with Bluetooth so it is possible that the connection would not stay up reliably. My bench testing with a USB-serial adapter works fine but I haven't run it for very long and the bench is a kinder environment.

Jean

[KW78]

Jean,

This path for a solution sounds pretty good.

We race enduros with these MS equipped cars and the bluetooth has saved our a$$ at COTA for example during pit stops. The EFI Analytics bluetooth module has ran well for a year in one of the cars in the race environment, so I think that part is reliable - (as long as your pairing up routine is not rushed...)

I am wanting to move to shadowdash for the instrument cluster to start getting complete logs of an average session fairly automatically, and to get these 20yr old cars a little more modern. I am finding that the "tune" is pretty far off between something that looks great on the dyno, to something that is actually on track drafting another car on the verge of overheating, with fuel boiling from the heat of the day and the pack. Even though MS3 has an SD card to log to (which the MS2 car doesn't - how I found shadowdash) it seems you can not log that many parameters and the file size limit is pretty small. My last shadow dash logfile was 6.5M.

Anyway, I see some of this stuff is available on your site, so I will PM you about it.

Thanks very much!
Kyle