MS3Pro-Ultimate Concept Idea

[Suprazz]

Hi, I would like to present my last concept idea. I want to build this for my customers but I would like to have feedback from the community for ideas or suggestions and if people like my idea.

The product is not completed and this is only the first draft. I could build the first prototype in around 1 week.

It's a MS3pro module version with a lot of features:

- Compact case 179mm x 154mm x 36mm (7.05" X 6.08" X 1.38").
- Heavy duty Mate and lock connectors
- 8x Peak and hold injector drivers (drive low and high impedance)
- Integrated 4 bar map sensor with baro correction
- Integrated wideband controller (Bosch 4.2 or 4.9 sensor)
- 1x EGT input
- 4x VR Signal conditionners for ABS sensors (traction control)

- DIP switches to enable/disable parallel and/or inline resistors to the crank and cam inputs for easier setup.

- 1x Red led for power monitoring (12v at the megasquirt)
- 1x Green led for Fuel pump output status
- Small internal prototype area.

Connectivity:
- Internal Bluetooth module (to serial connection to the MS) Work well with Android (MSDroid, Shadow Dash MS) and laptops (TunerStudio)
- Internal Wifi module (to serial connection tothe MS) Work with Android (MSDroid, Shadow Dash MS???), laptop (TunerStudio), IPhones and IPads (Mobisquirt)
- Serial connector
- USB connector

- External SD card access for easier log download (too slow via USB or serial port)

[hardline]

What sensor do you plan on using for the barometer?

[Suprazz]

same thing as the map sensor...

[hardline]

My recommendation would be to use a 1.15 bar sensor for the baro. Why use a sensor that you will limit your range with, as you will never see pressures over 1.085 bar anywhere on the planet.

[krisr]

The concept looks good. Pricing is going to be a determining factor but if you can do wideband in the same box you'd definitely need to use that in your marketing to help justify cost --- "Why buy an external wideband controller like an LC2 when it's already built in!"..

Also the bluetooth would need to be very fast and reliable IMO. I've used a few dongles on the serial port and they are quite slow... I couldn't tune a vehicle.

[racingmini_mtl]

I can see one advantage of having a built-in wideband sensor and that is to avoid 5V and ground reference issues. But that means the controller must use the same ground and 5V as the ECU. Even better would be if there was no digital-analog-digital chain but the MS3 code does not support that other than through using the CAN bus (which is fine with me).

But if this is intended as an ultimate concept, having a single WBO2 and single EGT seems to fall a little bit short on an 8-cylinder sequential setup. On the other hand, providing for a per-cylinder setup on both EGT and WBO2 would probably be overly expensive and require too many connector pins. That is one reason I'm not sure there is a good way of providing a universal setup: many will want more than one with some wanting a per-cylinder setup. So for those who want only one that may be ok but for anyone else, they will have to pay for one they won't use because they will likely want to have up to 8 identical WBO2 controllers and EGT inputs.

But you likely know your target for such a system better than me so it might be that a single WBO2 and EGT are enough. It's just does not seem "ultimate" to me especially since the MS3 does support per-cylinder cylinder options for these. And some have used them with great success.

Jean

[Suprazz]

@hardline: I already thought about it. Ther is not big advantage but yes why not. BTW you know that the Mapdaddy from diyautotune is also using 2x 4 bar map sensors?

@krisr: I'm already using this bluetooth modules in my plug and play ecu without any issues.

@Jean : Yeah you're right. The real "Ultimate" would require 8 wideband and etc. In normal application, we all know this wont happen but dual wideband is to consider (as an option to keep the price resonnable).

About the EGT, the idea was to provide a way to have a simple egt sensor because with the MS3, if you want only one, you need to build a circuit to interface it. There is no big advantages but it's not bad to have one.

[hardline]

I know the "mapdaddy" does, and I also had huge issues with it picking up noise which affected the barometric correction on my setup. I unsoldered it and soldered on a 1.15 bar sensor in it's place. Now the noise, while still there, is less than 1 kpa flutter, and I can deal with that.

[Suprazz]

thanks for the feedback. First time I hear that!

[MWPau]

Connectivity:
- Internal Bluetooth module (to serial connection to the MS) Work well with Android (MSDroid, Shadow Dash MS) and laptops (TunerStudio)
- Internal Wifi module (to serial connection tothe MS) Work with Android (MSDroid, Shadow Dash MS???), laptop (TunerStudio), IPhones and IPads (Mobisquirt)
- Serial connector
- USB connector

So the DIP switches are going to select between these?
You can only have two working at once (unless there is a way around that?).

Make sure you present CAN on a separate connector somewhere too.

[Suprazz]

Yes you can only run one connection at the same time.

Yes CAN is included in the front connector.

[MS2tester]

i would rather see a modular system
if i understand it correctly and you going to build a new pcb
the problem i have with all the integrated stuff is when it breaks
at bare minimum you are looking at shipping out your ecu and do expensive repairs possible buy a new ecu because that is cheaper
the same as OEM manufacturers

if on the otherhand you have a board in wich you can plug the hardware as you see fit
knock module , JB tinyOX , time module ,possible CAN EGT board , enz .....
have a system with multiple boards above each other

this would not only keep the base price lower
but also make repairs easier
imaging yourself on the race track and you lamda breaks down
you would have to keep an entire ecu as spare if everything is integrated
if everything is modular you would only keep the most vulnerable parts on spare

just my humble opinion

[Suprazz]

Yes it will be a modular system but if course, I cannot put all single feature on a separate pcb because if I do that the cost will be very high.

The more expensives modules will be on a socket for easy remplacement but based on my experiences, it's very rare that this kind of electronics break.

[ol boy]

Add a MC9s12 chip set in there to run the trans code james is working on.

[racingmini_mtl]

Add a MC9s12 chip set in there to run the trans code james is working on.

That would go against the current license which limits the use of the code to MS2, Microsquirt, Microsquirt module and GPIO.

Jean

[hardline]

You could make an expansion port for a microsquirt module to plug into the mainboard.