Recomended Hall Sensor

[lotushiast]

Hello,

i want to go with a Hall Sensor for the cam and crank 60-2 OR 36-1 trigger for full sequential.
Is this a better solution than a VR setup.
Which Hall Sensors are recomended ?

Regards Harald.

[heychris_1]

I've tried several of the hall sensors. It really depends on your trigger wheel. The trigger wheel I ended up using was a custom made one that was slightly smaller than the ford EDIS trigger wheel. I initially bought the honeywell GT1. I couldn't get a consistent signal out of it. My problem ended up being that the trigger wheel didn't have enough gap between them. You need to make sure your trigger wheel meets the spec.

http://www.honeywell-sensor.com.cn/prod ... 5838_1.pdf

I ended up using a Hamlin hall sensor. It doesn't require as much gap between teeth as the GT1. It works much better than the GT1 for my trigger wheel. The signal is perfect and consistent. The hamlin sensor has an internal pullup resistor so you don't need to add one.

http://www.hamlin.com/specsheets/55075%20IssueAF.pdf

Personally I think this is a better setup than the VR sensors. The VR are bulletproof if you can tune them in. I've noticed all the car manufacturers have switched to hall sensors.

[bubba2533]

I used that same Hamlin Hall sensor for a custom project. Worked great and it was easy to get working.

I think hall sensors are easier for custom projects. But if you car has a VR sensor just do a little research to see if others have got it to work. Try and cross reference the sensor to other cars and such. My VR in my subaru cut out above 4k rpm until I found some one else that used the same sensor with a couple resistors and it works flawless now.

[prof315]

With either wheel ( 60-2 or 36-1) I like using the VR sensor from a Ford explorer with a 4.0L sohc motor on projects that didn't have a wheel from the factory. They are cheap, readily available, and I have never had one fail or even seen one fail (and I am an auto tech by trade). It also mounts easily on a custom bracket and uses the same connector as an EV1 injector. With a 60-2 tooth wheel I generally add a 10K resistor to the VR+ to make sure I have no high rpm signal drop.

[VolvoGuy50]

I've got the above-mention Hamlin, and many have said Cherry ones work nicely as well.

[jsmcortina]

I agree with Jeff, for most installs OEM type VR sensors work just fine. Hall/geartooth sensors can be used but make sure the temperature rating is sufficient.

Note that true Hall sensors require a magnet. Geartooth sensors detect ferrous material with just the sensor. (See the manual.)

The times I'd use a geartooth sensor are:
- cam phase sensor for very low speeds
- "odd" patterns that use a long-tooth or otherwise do not work correctly with the existing VR input hardware.

James

[Jon k]

I have seen a few different hall sensors mention their switching frequency and only see a max of like 2 khz - 3khz. If running a 60-2 wheel, 7000 RPM = 117 rotations per second, with 60 teeth, thats 7000 hz, or 7.0khz...

I am running a BMW with a Cherry GS100502 and it seems to work fine, but it makes me wonder how the switching frequency works when they tend to be half of what is required.

[heychris_1]

It also truck me as odd that the frequency wasn't quite what I'd expect. Interestingly BMW has been running hall sensors since 2004 for the crankshaft. It started with the N52 engine.

[kritip]

DO you have any part numbers or specifications on BMW Hall crank sensors?

I run a VR on a 60-2. Typical to FIAT group installations. The size is similar but not the same as aftermarket hall sensors.

The typical dimension FIAT use is as per the picture. 18mm diameter, 35mm barrel length, with a 19mm centre to bolt hole. Is the BMW similar or the same?



Uploaded with ImageShack.us

Cheers,

Kristian

[myk777]

I've used these Allegro sensors on 3 installations and they have worked great.

http://www.allegromicro.com/en/Products ... rs/ats.asp

I originally had my yamaha quad engine setup with a 24-1 on the cam, then later switched to a 36-1crank and single tooth on the cam, all done with the 616 sensors, this motor regularly see's 11,000+ rpms. Also just finished my jeep project with an AMC360 v8, installed a 48-1 wheel on the crank with the same 616 sensor, again it works flawless. I believe the 617 has now replaced the 616. I usually make up a threaded stud and pot the sensor in with JB weld to get the exact geometry I need.

Mike

[racingmini_mtl]

Digikey has the new Allegro 627 sensor (http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSea ... -1398-1-ND) which is rated at 20kHz and 12000RPM for a 60+2 wheel. That should be good enough for most applications.

It should be noted that I have no experience with this sensor but Allegro seems to have a good reputation. So I would personally not be concerned about trying this sensor if I were to make my own setup similar to what Mike described.

Jean

[myk777]

Here's a few pics of how I build the sensors, it goes pretty fast. First trim and bend the leads, solder on the wires, wrap the sensor in kapton tape and then install some shrink tubing over the wires and pot it with JB weld. I've had the one in my quad running inside the engine bathed in oil for several years, no issues. The one shown is the cam sensor on my quad which needed to be very compact, the thread is a 10x1 metric.

Mike

[myk777]

Here's the one for the crank wheel, a bit more custom on the bracket, good to have friends with cnc machines

Mike

[racingmini_mtl]

Really nice work. What gap do use between the sensor and trigger wheel?

Jean

[myk777]

Really nice work. What gap do use between the sensor and trigger wheel?

Jean

I've bench tested them on my lathe while varying the gap and they seem to work with a wide range of gaps, the datasheet specifies .4mm to 2.5mm. I usually run them around 1 to 1.5mm or .040" to .060". The other benefit of these is the input circuit is dead simple (as compared to the VR circuit). In fact with using these and P+H drivers, the v3.0 board is pretty darn empty.....

Mike

[racingmini_mtl]

The other benefit of these is the input circuit is dead simple (as compared to the VR circuit). In fact with using these and P+H drivers, the v3.0 board is pretty darn empty.....

Mike

Yeah, I know what you mean... But the VR circuit can also be very small and simple. I have 2 VR circuits that fit on a board 1.1"x0.7" and that includes the headers for the inputs and outputs, 2 mounting holes and a 5V power supply...

Jean

[jalai]

Here's a few pics of how I build the sensors, it goes pretty fast. First trim and bend the leads, solder on the wires, wrap the sensor in kapton tape and then install some shrink tubing over the wires and pot it with JB weld. I've had the one in my quad running inside the engine bathed in oil for several years, no issues. The one shown is the cam sensor on my quad which needed to be very compact, the thread is a 10x1 metric.

Mike

Installation like this threaded tube is not a good idea, because You need to know a sensor direction (in relation to wheel rotation).
Otherwise a really nice sensor which works with a dense target wheel.

[myk777]

Installation like this threaded tube is not a good idea, because You need to know a sensor direction (in relation to wheel rotation).
Otherwise a really nice sensor which works with a dense target wheel.

Look close at the last picture in the lower right hand side there is a small notch machined into the outside of the threaded tube for orientation.

Mike

[kritip]

Mike, I am loving that idea. The IC's are very cheap compared to the flange type, and you can customise the specifiction a lot better.

I may take an old VR sensor, see if I can gut it, and then use the housing. If not M18 threaded tube will do. Is alu or some non magnetic metal prefered for the housing?

Cheers,

Kristian

[myk777]

Is alu or some non magnetic metal prefered for the housing?
Kristian

I've used both aluminum and steel, it doesn't seem to have any affect on the sensor.

Mike