Step #1, Turn everything OFF

[ol boy]

With my first MS build I thought I could set ALL the settings and they would be close enough to get me going. Well.. after chasing my ass for 2 weeks with all the improper set settings I finally turned everything off but my fan output and worked on getting a good smooth VE table. As I got more comfortable with TS and tuning in general, adding in the other features like Over Run Fuel Cut, MAT base timing retard, and closed loop idle control became seamless. Now all features which are turned on work together and small changes can be made without upsetting the whole system.

Happy tuning!

Ryan

[E4ODnut]

I agree with Ryan.

I run open loop only. The logic is that in closed loop I am depending on the accuracy of the O2 data to "dither" around my commanded mixtures. Careful open loop tuning should be able to achieve better results, assuming that all my other inputs are accurate. I'm not saying that closed loop is not a good thing, and may even be better, but I tune for quite a wide range of ratios and just prefer to do it this way.

One thing that I think is very important is to get your start up, idle, and no load mixture dialed in as close as possible before you even head out on the road. This is documented in the manuals and will save lots of headaches later if you have this solid base to work from.

As for auto tuning features, I'm not so sure. I know there are people who swear by it, but I've never really tried it. Tuner Studio is a wonderful piece of work and I can't say enough good things about it. I feel the same way about MegaLogViewer. From my experience though, I've found that VE Analyze will get me pretty close to my targets, but then it seems to "overshoot". I get my best results by data logging, studying the logs, trimming a bit, and repeating the process. It is time consuming though, and there may be a better way.

[sedd]

Ryan,

I am in the same situation. I too have started over.

I re-adjusted my AFR table and Spark Table and have tried to get the VE tables closer for low throttle and idle areas. Now I plan to go back and try to work on the idle one more time to see if I missed anything using the ignition advance in the regular table. I have been using idle control with closed loop with some success but I think I want to also turn that off again to recheck the open tune settings. I have been running with my throttle plates fully closed but think I need to open it up a bit using the mechanical stop screw so the IAC valve steps are closer to mid range of 0-255 instead of being 255 at idle. This makes sense to me but there is nothing in the manuals to indicate this is how to start with the basic tune.

this is what I come up with to turn off, what do think, did I miss any?:

1 Fuel Settings / AFR/EGO Control = off
2 Basic Load Settings / Fan Control / Fan control idles up? = off
3 Basic Load Settings / Barometric Corrections = all corrections set to zero
4 Basic Load Settings / Leave input smoothing lag factors to base tune settings, 50 for all but Lambda that is set to 60.
5 Accel enrich / Acceleration Enrichment Settings / Low Rpm Threshhold(rpm) = 7900 or higher than my rpm limiter
6 Start up idle / Idle advance = off
7 Start up idle / Idle VE settings = off

[ol boy]

I see your running MS3. All those extras that make the code so good also make it hard to get right if you try jumping in with both feet first. As for your IAC settings... Start in open loop, set the steps to around 75ish which is about 30% open, then adjust your throttle plate until you get to your desired RPM at your current CLT temp. This gives 70% over head for cranking position and enough of a controlled vacuum leak for closed loop to work properly down the road.

Work with what you need and add in all the cool crap later.

Ryan.

[techsalvager]

Zero out the default manifold air temp correction that goes on. esp if your air temps swing around 80f a lot.
One minute you maybe pulling fuel at idle despite clt being at operating temp, the next underway you find you need to add fuel because iat's have gone up.

Either way zero them out until you get a good tune going.

[kjones6039]

Zero out the default manifold air temp correction that goes on. esp if your air temps swing around 80f a lot.
One minute you maybe pulling fuel at idle despite clt being at operating temp, the next underway you find you need to add fuel because iat's have gone up.

Either way zero them out until you get a good tune going.

I have IAT zeroed out on my MS2 but continue to see IAT correction. Any idea why this happens?

Ken

[techsalvager]

Zero out the default manifold air temp correction that goes on. esp if your air temps swing around 80f a lot.
One minute you maybe pulling fuel at idle despite clt being at operating temp, the next underway you find you need to add fuel because iat's have gone up.

Either way zero them out until you get a good tune going.

I have IAT zeroed out on my MS2 but continue to see IAT correction. Any idea why this happens?

Ken

upload your tune and a datalog

[pit_celica]

Zero out the default manifold air temp correction that goes on. esp if your air temps swing around 80f a lot.
One minute you maybe pulling fuel at idle despite clt being at operating temp, the next underway you find you need to add fuel because iat's have gone up.

Either way zero them out until you get a good tune going.

I have IAT zeroed out on my MS2 but continue to see IAT correction. Any idea why this happens?

Ken

This is normal. Zeroing the non-linear MAT curve means that you are using the ideal gas law directly. So, Gair vary with MAT as said by the ideal gas law. You can remove this effect (or intensify it) by playing with the non-linear MAT curve.

Sam

[sedd]

techsalvager, I dont understand the idea around the MAT and 80 deg F swing. Could you expand on that? Does that have something to do with the MAT/CLT Correction?

My Non linear MAT correction table is set to 0% at all MAT temps.

Ryan, thanks, that info about the IAT was exactly the direction I needed.

[kjones6039]

This is normal. Zeroing the non-linear MAT curve means that you are using the ideal gas law directly. So, Gair vary with MAT as said by the ideal gas law. You can remove this effect (or intensify it) by playing with the non-linear MAT curve.

Sam

Sam,

Thanks for the explanation! It's not a big deal to me right now, but I have noticed what I think is IAT sensor heat soak, when the weather was warmer. which was giving me some lean issues after a hot start. I suspected they were related to IAT correction so I zeroed them out for the time being.

I have now moved the sensor to my cold air intake tube and will revisit IAT correction when the weather warms up.

Thanks again,

Ken

Ken

[techsalvager]

This what I meant


Uploaded with ImageShack.us
This should almost stop MAT for changing fueling