Very Rich but reasonable to Lean AFR. RX7 13B-REW

[slattery_caleb]

I am still working through an initial setup and tune, just trying to get my AFR mixture to somewhere i can work with.

looking on my wideband AFR gauge in the car as well as in tuner studio, I am seeing high 14 to 15 reading while ideling, which i thought wasn't to bad, but there is clouds of black smoke coming out the back and the engine eventually floods itself and stalls.

when i take the plugs out to dry them off and de flood the engine, the front housing's plugs are the worst, quite black with some crusty carbon and a wet oily mixture.

Any ideas what may cause this??

most of my curves like the cranking, WUE and ASE are quite messy and all over the place, I've been playing around with these a fair bit trying to get the engine to start and not flood.


Caleb

[Matt Cramer]

The wideband will get an average reading between the two cylinders - it sounds like rotor 1 is running richer than rotor 2. Could the injectors have been miswired if you are using staged injection? Or mismatched injectors?

[arran]

What type of WBO2 are you using and have you calibrated it?

[slattery_caleb]

The wideband will get an average reading between the two cylinders - it sounds like rotor 1 is running richer than rotor 2. Could the injectors have been miswired if you are using staged injection? Or mismatched injectors?

As far as i know, going by the colors, al fourl injectors are 880's, and have been cleaned and checked.
I was trying to use the test mode to confirm the wiring (A= primary 1, B=primary 2, C= secondary 1, D= secondary 2) using a noide light on each plug, i couldnt get any of them to work, but looking at them all while cranking the light flashes with each pulse.
When i re-wired the engine loom for the new engine, each plug was cut off and replaced 1 at a time and they were labeled originally.

What type of WBO2 are you using and have you calibrated it?

That was the first thing i thought of. I am using a AEM wideband with a gauge installed aswell. i have calibrated it, tuner studio is reading the same value as the AEM gauge.

Caleb

[slattery_caleb]

Ok I worked out the issue with my test mode, i didn't activate the fuel pump.

injector wiring confirmed.
A= front Primary
B= Rear Primary
C= Front secondary
D= Rear Secondary.


Caleb

[arran]

Looking at msq, things that jump out
Firing order should be 1 2, not 1 3
For closed loop idle you are using initial value table but all values are 0
Why does the idle valve have minimum value of 14.9? Are you using a flyback diode on the BAC?

[slattery_caleb]

Ok, thanks for taking the time to help out ArranI'll look at the firing order. When I went through and did all the settings I followed Aaron Cakes write up, that is the firing order he has. Do you know if there was a change with different firmware revisions.

I am going to turn all the idle valve stuff off and come back to it, so it is not adding another factor to the problem.

Yes it does have a diode in the wiring. I was following Aaron cakes setup for the BAC also. What is that 14.9 figure for??

Caleb

[slattery_caleb]

bump


Caleb

[Matt Cramer]

Can you post a data log of it running?

[slattery_caleb]

here is a data log.

The last restart has the idle control switched off

thanks for having a look.


Caleb

[arran]

I don't know where 14.9 came from, I am using ms3, cpu 3 and ms3x and once I installed the flyback my BAC responded from 0 to 100 in test mode. On an FC inlet manifold.

Have you fixed the firing order?

I can see form your latest log that it is having trouble starting, and runs 15msecs pri injector time on cranking. My data log shows 18msecs which is counter intuitive with your richness but I think you need more crank fuel, my setup is1000cc. IIRC you have 850cc so you should have a lot more msecs than me, base pressure aside. The firing order may be messing things up.

You then go on to idle at 7msecs, my setup is at 4msecs.

PWM idle is pegged for some reason, batt voltage look too low though may just be a calibration issue.

Pull you ignition advance at idle back form 10 to closer to 5.

Your secondary injectors are activating at idle which is going to be causing you problems

[slattery_caleb]

thanks for having a look mate.

yes i did set the firing order to 1 2. it is still wired to-
A= Front Primary
B= Rear Primary
C= Front Secondary
D= Rear Secondary

ill have a look at those things tomorrow. what do you think would be causing the secondary injectors to come in to early.

Caleb

[arran]

My injectors and ignition are wired like this (which looks to be the same as you):

Outputs Source Destination Pin
Injector A MS3X engine, Front Primary 19
Injector B MS3X engine, Rear Primary 16
Injector C MS3X engine, Front Secondary 13
Injector D MS3X engine, Rear Secondary 10
Ignition A MS3X engine, front leading 14
Ignition B MS3X engine, rear leading 33
Ignition C MS3X engine, front trailing 15
Ignition D MS3X engine, rear trailing 34

The full details are shown here:
http://web.aanet.com.au/~arran/car/projectpart7.html

Also your CAS settings look very weird. I am not sure about FD, but FC is definitely 24/2 Nippondenso CAS, can't see how FD would be much different. You have 36/1 with a 92 offset.

[slattery_caleb]

Ok, yeah mine is wired the same, except I am not using spark b because it's wasted spark on the leading.

My CAS is a totally different wheel from full function engineering. It's a 36-1 (missing tooth) and now only runs 1 VR sensor. 90 deg tooth #1 angle was what they said the starting setting they gave me, it needed 92 to get TDC lined up and it seems the advance holds well when I give it a gentle rev. The only setting that didn't match was, they had ignition capture in falling edge, I needed it set to rising otherwise it didn't sense the engine was cranking.

Caleb

[slattery_caleb]

what would you expect the load to be at around idle.

caleb

[arran]

My engine pulls about 48.5kPa at 950rpm.