msq file for a Rover SD1 V8

[psoma]

Hi all,

Just installed my MS2 after years of MS1 use. Unfortunately, I can't seem to get the fueling right before the plugs foul up and it starts misfiring. Once there, I have to muck around a lot to get it even firing right again, and then everything is way off. Has anyone got a TunerStudio file or msq for a (relatively) stock 3.5 Rover Vitesse V8 that I can at least use as a base for fine tuning?

Many thanks,

Tom

[DaveEFI]

IMHO it's not advisable to use someone else's MSQ from the off especially since most RV8s wiil be modified in some way. It really is easier to start with the base map. There are so many variables that need to be set correctly and may not be the same between two seemingly similar engines. For example, the standard RV8 3.5 EFI uses low impedance injectors and you have the choice of using these with or without resistors. Which makes a difference to some settings.
Once you have it running reasonably well, by all means compare your tables with another.

Post a log and the MSQ here.

[psoma]

I suppose part of the problem is I don't have those base settings - for all intents and purposes, the engine is stock (injectors are running through the ballast resistor pack) - I don't know what to set the General Settings to (fuel map I can sort)?

[jsmcortina]

I suppose part of the problem is I don't have those base settings - for all intents and purposes, the engine is stock (injectors are running through the ballast resistor pack) - I don't know what to set the General Settings to (fuel map I can sort)?

Have you read the Setting Up manual?

James

[DaveEFI]

If you do a fresh load of the latest code, that includes a base amp. The manual will guide you though doing all the initial settings. This really doesn't take much longer than checking through an MSQ you've got from elsewhere. And it is important you have things like the CTS, ATS, TPS etc correctly calibrated. And the correct req. fuel.

I know it seems a bit daunting at first - but if you take your time it will make sense. And you'll get help here for anything you need clarification on.

The only real alternative is to have a pro do all this for you. But it won't be cheap.

[sd1nl]

I run a completely stock vitesse with stock resistor pack and stock injectors. You can use my tune.

But I agree with Dave: don't just load another one's msq, just use it as a reference and make your own.

In the link below you can find my msq in the first post:

http://www.msextra.com/forums/viewtopic ... 91&t=55319

Rene

[psoma]

Thanks guys,

The MS1 I had was pre-configured for an SD1 so I've never had to go through this initial setup before (just had to tweak the fuel map). I have read the setup guide, but that presunes I know a few details that I don't. Rene's msq will give me those numbers and I'll take it from there... Hopefully my next post will contain good news!

Oh, and I will do a fresh load of the latest code... This one hasn't been updated since I bought the MS2 4 years ago.

Cheers,

Tom

[psoma]

Actually.... I just saw in that post you linked to Rene that both yourself and Dave were having hot start problems. I had hot start problems with my MS1 and would have to click the ignition over 2-3 times prior to cranking to fire the priming pulse before it would start when hot. No matter how much I fiddled with cranking settings, I couldn't get it to start when hot when it didn't want to. Did you guys ever get that one ironed out as the thread seemed to die a premature death?

Cheers,

Tom

[DaveEFI]

Never did get my hot starting perfect. It's reliable, if you use about 1/4 throttle. It then runs very weak for a minute or so until the ATS shows something a bit more normal - it will be reading 80C or so with the engine stopped, and takes some time to show what must be the true air temp with the engine running.

I've still got just the original flapper extra air valve for cold fast idle, and of course that doesn't open with the engine hot. I'm intending changing to a stepper motor idle control.

Cold start isn't instantaneous either. Takes 5 seconds of churning - then starts and idles perfectly while warming up. Runs fine too while warming up.

Since I'm the only one who drives this car its starting foibles don't much matter - as it runs so well otherwise.

[sd1nl]

Don't have either cold or hot start problems anymore. Starts on the button everytime. Since I cleaned my injectors and changed to a trigger wheel and went semi sequential in 2013 the problem somehow cured completely......

[DaveEFI]

Don't have either cold or hot start problems anymore. Starts on the button everytime. Since I cleaned my injectors and changed to a trigger wheel and went semi sequential in 2013 the problem somehow cured completely......

Looking at a starting from cold log, my engine turns for 2 sec before seeing a tach signal (EDIS) then a further 3 seconds before starting. Cranking speed is shown as 100 rpm - but what does seem a bit odd to me is the MAP only drops from 100 KPa to 90 when cranking.

Injectors have been replaced with new - no difference whatsoever.

I built a new MS2 last year with an external coil driver pack to change from EDIS to direct control. Just never got round to fitting it. I'll look into semi-sequential injection.

[sd1nl]

don't know wether it was the injector cleaning or the change to semi-seq. This because I did the change in one go, but all starting problems went away.

Good thing, because I hate bad starts.

[jsmcortina]

Cold start isn't instantaneous either. Takes 5 seconds of churning - then starts and idles perfectly while warming up. Runs fine too while warming up.

My Rover V8 starts way better than that at any temperature, usually a couple of revs then fires right up. No need to touch the thottle at all.

James

[DaveEFI]

Cold start isn't instantaneous either. Takes 5 seconds of churning - then starts and idles perfectly while warming up. Runs fine too while warming up.

My Rover V8 starts way better than that at any temperature, usually a couple of revs then fires right up. No need to touch the thottle at all.

James

Yehbut you're clever. And probably sequential everything?

Heat soak was also a problem on the original SD1 with the Lucas flapper injection. It may well be down to the installation rather than engine itself. All I've really changed as regards the injection is the ECU to MS.

[sd1nl]

@ Tom:

One thing about my tune:

In my tune the required fuel value is divided by two, and all the values in the fuel table are therefore multiplied bij two. This means for instance that the starting pulse is also double the value.

Remember this when comparing values.

Rene

[psoma]

Thanks Rene... Is that as a result of the 2 injections per engine cycle?

Note: The car now starts and runs. But I'm only getting action on 6 of the 8 cylinders. Think the injectors aren't firing. Thanks for your help guys, already a lot closer!

Cheers,

Tom

[sd1nl]

The 2 squirts per cycle simultaneous is necessary for semi sequential operation. But I think you don't want to run that way, because you have to modify the board with 2 additional injector drivers for that.

If you load my file inyour car probably 4 injectors won't work. You have to set it up 2 squirts alternating but not in semi sequential mode and disable the additional drivers.


What I meant is that I doubled the injector size from 190 to 380cc to cut the required fuel in half, and then I doubled all the values in the fuel table. it's a trick to get more resolution out of the fuel table, in other words: the steps are smaller.

Rene

[psoma]

Ah, yep, I see what you did there - clever!

I disabled all additional outputs, switched it to fuel only, and fire alternating before turning the key over the other day. It's fairly close, but once I get it firing on all 8 again, I'll run the tuning wizard to get the fuelling spot on.

Thanks again for your help guys... Think I might just get it ready in time for my wedding day ;)

Cheers,

Tom

[jsmcortina]

Cold start isn't instantaneous either. Takes 5 seconds of churning - then starts and idles perfectly while warming up. Runs fine too while warming up.

My Rover V8 starts way better than that at any temperature, usually a couple of revs then fires right up. No need to touch the thottle at all.

James

Yehbut you're clever. And probably sequential everything?

cortinav8-start.png

Takes 0.27 seconds from battery voltage drop until RPMs show up, then another 0.27 seconds before it bursts into life.

The drop in RPMs a couple of seconds later is when the oil pump wakes up.

James