Idle control on ITBs

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Idle control on ITBs

Postby radiogareth » Tue Mar 29, 2016 1:30 am

Looking for suggestions here....Its a 2 litre Silvertop Zetec running Triumph throttle bodies each of which has a 6mm bore tap-off point on the engine side of the butterfly. On the bike these fed a small common plenum that provided idle air via a stepper motor controlled valve. I know ITBs don't provide much help with MAP readings so I may end up with alpha-N or hybrid alpha-N. However, I still need to sort some form of idle control. Simplest for me would be a 2 wire Ford idle control solenoid on a simple plate that feeds idle air to all 4 ITBs. I'm wondering if this will compromise any useful MAP I may be getting.
Advice and suggestions welcome......
Thanks
Gareth
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Re: Idle control on ITBs

Postby Paul_VR6 » Wed Mar 30, 2016 6:10 am

Map will likely be high at low rpm regardless. Each port to a common plenum (I use fuel rail stock) to a 2 wire valve is the easiest imo.
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Re: Idle control on ITBs

Postby radiogareth » Thu Mar 31, 2016 12:23 am

Hi Paul, Went ahead and built up a copper plumbing bitsa on the back of a Ford ICV. We are getting 80KPa at Idle, just need to sort out the control for the valve now. The angled inlet pipe will have a small 'K&N' type air filter to feed clean air in.
2016-03-30 17.36.06.jpg

Still work in progress (as they always are!) but cooland goes in today and we can run it more then.
Cheers

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Re: Idle control on ITBs

Postby radiogareth » Mon Apr 04, 2016 3:12 am

As my ITBs don't have any form of throttle stop I'm wondering if its feasible to let the idle control solenoid control idle speed at all times, not just during warm-up. I'm fairly sure Ford runs it all the time.
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Re: Idle control on ITBs

Postby muythaibxr » Mon Apr 04, 2016 4:27 am

radiogareth wrote:As my ITBs don't have any form of throttle stop I'm wondering if its feasible to let the idle control solenoid control idle speed at all times, not just during warm-up. I'm fairly sure Ford runs it all the time.


This is how my ITB-equipped car works.
Megasquirt is not for use on pollution controlled vehicles. Any advice I give is for off road use only.

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Re: Idle control on ITBs

Postby radiogareth » Mon Apr 04, 2016 4:48 am

OK, anything special needed in the idle setups? I'd be grateful for pointers.....
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Re: Idle control on ITBs

Postby gary_808 » Tue Apr 05, 2016 1:25 pm

On mine used alpha-n,

Set the idle with throttle stop that I made and the map.
Never used an idle valve ever. Daily drove the car through out the year all weather never had a problem.
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Re: Idle control on ITBs

Postby muythaibxr » Tue Apr 05, 2016 4:16 pm

Nothing special needed for me. I run closed loop idle with pretty standard settings.
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Re: Idle control on ITBs

Postby dontz125 » Tue Apr 05, 2016 4:42 pm

radiogareth wrote:As my ITBs don't have any form of throttle stop I'm wondering if its feasible to let the idle control solenoid control idle speed at all times, not just during warm-up. I'm fairly sure Ford runs it all the time.

Doing a bit of research for a potential customer contemplating CBR600 ITBs, I noticed the '01-06 models used a coolant pod for warm-up air only with an adjustable throttle stop. The '07 design dropped the coolant plumbing and throttle stop in favour of a stepper IACV.
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Re: Idle control on ITBs

Postby radiogareth » Wed Apr 06, 2016 12:51 am

Yes, the Triumph ITBs had a small stepper-based idle control system that fitted to the original airbox, hence no throttle stop as part of the system. It was expandable to 4 ports but not easy to feed with clean air in this situation. Plus the inherited wiring loom came with it set-up for a 1-wire solenoid and I had one in the spares box. Choosing 'Closed loop' is the bit I was missing. If the engine tries to stall I see the Idle% shoot up but its normally at 0%. What I was sort of hoping for was a 'target idle rpm' box where that idle RPM can be chosen, with added warm-up on top, as per most cars. Back to the manual and software for a play later today I hope.
Thanks for inputs...

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Re: Idle control on ITBs

Postby radiogareth » Tue Apr 19, 2016 10:31 am

Some progress this end, engine is now capable of cold start and warm-up plus some basic no-load tuning with a WBO2.

As far as I can tell the Ford ICS does not fully close when not energised so I guess I set everything up for a reasonable idle when warm and NO control signal (or very small) going to it. When cold its going to need a bit of extra air and at that point the ICS should get a signal. Or it would if I hadn't sent my TIP122 to semiconductor heaven :-(

Electronically I can't see any reason why I cant replace it with a suitable FET like a IRF510 which was designed for switching duties. Or even a Logic level FET (rated at 30 amps, not that it needs 30 amps!)

Comments from successful users of 2 wire Ford ICS very welcome....

Thanks

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