No cranking PW indicating on dash display during cranking

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No cranking PW indicating on dash display during cranking

Postby woznaldo » Fri Apr 21, 2017 6:17 am

I had been running my MS1 Extra setup for ignition only for sometime. I've finally got around to fitting my EFI setup after an engine rebuild (run in on the old carb) and I can't get it to start. It turns over ok, shows rpm of around 300 which jumps to 500 after splutter. The manual said to check TPS wiring which I did and found 0v and 5v inverted. That was fixed and TPS re-calibrated. still not displaying Cranking PW, although there is a smell of fuel coming out of the exhaust?

I've attached the msq file to see if anyone can see anything obvious. I haven't taken a datalog yet.

The car is a Renault 5 GT Turbo running a 1397cc OHV inline 4, 8 valve with T2 turbo

All advice appreciated.

Woz
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Trying to make my Renault 5 GT Turbo a bit more driveable and a lot more reliable!
woznaldo
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Re: No cranking PW indicating on dash display during crankin

Postby Matt Cramer » Fri Apr 21, 2017 6:43 am

I'd like to see the data log too. These are often a sensor issue.
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Re: No cranking PW indicating on dash display during crankin

Postby woznaldo » Fri Apr 21, 2017 6:48 am

I'll grab one first thing in the morning. Don't think the neighbours would appreciate it now (almost midnight!).
Trying to make my Renault 5 GT Turbo a bit more driveable and a lot more reliable!
woznaldo
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Re: No cranking PW indicating on dash display during crankin

Postby woznaldo » Sat Apr 22, 2017 6:06 am

Finally got round to taking a few logs, but not before re-reading the manual and the special note about MS1 Extra and the TPS Flood Clear setting (still at zero. Ooops)

So I now get PW displaying on the Tunerstudio display, but still having start issues. I have noticed that my spark advance goes to zero while cranking? Not sure if this is normal?

All of my after start enrichments are set to zero. Is this ok?

msq and logs attached
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Trying to make my Renault 5 GT Turbo a bit more driveable and a lot more reliable!
woznaldo
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Posts: 56
Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2004 7:51 am
Location: Canberra (Previously UK)

Re: No cranking PW indicating on dash display during crankin

Postby woznaldo » Sat Apr 22, 2017 3:37 pm

I should also point out that my starter motor has been sticking (despite being relatively new), so there are several clicks followed by ignition off and having another go until the engine finally turns.

The motor was initially cranking at 250-300 rpm, but then seemed to free up and turn at 500 rpm (i can't remember if this was after a particular MS adjustment?) and I did have my cranking RPM set at 500. should I raised this to 600?
Trying to make my Renault 5 GT Turbo a bit more driveable and a lot more reliable!
woznaldo
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Posts: 56
Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2004 7:51 am
Location: Canberra (Previously UK)

Re: No cranking PW indicating on dash display during crankin

Postby woznaldo » Sat Apr 22, 2017 6:48 pm

Ok, I made a few changes to my settings as follows:

Cranking PW
Image

After Start Enrichment
Image

Datalog of Ignition Advance during Cranking
Image

The car turns over quite happily at around 200 rpm (battery not charged since first attempt) and occasionally does a single 'pop' from the exhaust? Not sure what this means other than fuel and spark are getting somewhere??

Is it normal for the ignition advance to have a static advance of 10-11 deg and then it drop to ZERO during cranking?
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Trying to make my Renault 5 GT Turbo a bit more driveable and a lot more reliable!
woznaldo
Helpful MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 56
Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2004 7:51 am
Location: Canberra (Previously UK)

Re: No cranking PW indicating on dash display during crankin

Postby woznaldo » Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:35 am

In the 'Spark Settings' the EDIS info in the manual says to set the 'Cranking Advance Angle' to -10, so I assume that's why the TunerStudio display shows 0 advance during cranking (spark table (+10) + cranking advance (-10) = 0? Can I adjust this to get the car started?

The car has started on the current spark table and settings (whilst on the old carb), but was very lumpy and it took a few attempts.

Does MS1Extra have injector dead time? I'm running 440cc/min injectors (Bosch Green Giants) on my 1397cc OHV Engine (hoping for big things) and wondering if my Cranking PW is still too high?

Here's the lastest msq and datalog.

Woz
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Trying to make my Renault 5 GT Turbo a bit more driveable and a lot more reliable!
woznaldo
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Posts: 56
Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2004 7:51 am
Location: Canberra (Previously UK)

Re: No cranking PW indicating on dash display during crankin

Postby woznaldo » Sun Apr 23, 2017 7:39 pm

Can someone please confirm that injector dead time and injector opening time are one and the same?
Trying to make my Renault 5 GT Turbo a bit more driveable and a lot more reliable!
woznaldo
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Location: Canberra (Previously UK)

Re: No cranking PW indicating on dash display during crankin

Postby Matt Cramer » Mon Apr 24, 2017 8:13 am

What MS1 called opening time is more accurately dead time. Later firmwares corrected this potential source of confusion.
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Re: No cranking PW indicating on dash display during crankin

Postby woznaldo » Mon Apr 24, 2017 7:00 pm

Thanks Matt, I was a little confused with the different names for it. Hopefully this is my issue and I should be able to reduce the cranking pulse width to prevent flooding.

I will just reduce the 'injector opening time' a little to see if it helps, but appreciate an accurate measure of opening time should be derived experimentally using my MS1 (and hence the actual drivers being used).
Trying to make my Renault 5 GT Turbo a bit more driveable and a lot more reliable!
woznaldo
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Posts: 56
Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2004 7:51 am
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Re: No cranking PW indicating on dash display during crankin

Postby woznaldo » Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:31 am

Ok, I'm not sure what's happening at the moment, but I couldn't even get the car to fire, no matter what PW I choose. I noticed that ignition advance was sometimes meant going to zero and other times going to -10 (EDIS setup).

I can only assume that my cranking RPM is set too low and it's switched from cranking to the base map? That said, when I advance the cranking angle to the 10 BTDC the car engine almost stuttered into life momentarily, but the advance was zero while ch is not what the base map would be at 99 kPa??
Trying to make my Renault 5 GT Turbo a bit more driveable and a lot more reliable!
woznaldo
Helpful MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 56
Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2004 7:51 am
Location: Canberra (Previously UK)

Re: No cranking PW indicating on dash display during crankin

Postby Matt Cramer » Wed Apr 26, 2017 8:09 am

:msq:
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Re: No cranking PW indicating on dash display during crankin

Postby woznaldo » Wed Apr 26, 2017 1:43 pm

Sorry, wasn't on my laptop and didn't have access to them. Here they are:
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Trying to make my Renault 5 GT Turbo a bit more driveable and a lot more reliable!
woznaldo
Helpful MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 56
Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2004 7:51 am
Location: Canberra (Previously UK)


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