First drive in my MSnSe 911 Turbo! But got towed home....

All Megasquirt 1 support questions. See also the Documentation

Moderators: jsmcortina, muythaibxr

Post Reply
Miles965uk
MS/Extra Newbie
Posts: 16
Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2005 6:18 am

First drive in my MSnSe 911 Turbo! But got towed home....

Post by Miles965uk »

After 10 months working on getting MS to run the spark on my '94 911 Turbo... it fired up! I am still using the original fuel CIS system for now.
Many thanks to everyones help esp James & Bill.

I have been driving it up and down my street to test it all out and all has been been fine, So yesterday I took her for a drive and about 10miles into it all was going fine and then it just cut out! A french policeman gave me a helpful push off the road ( Im living in Paris)

So I tried to start again but nothing, if I let the fuel pumps run a bit on their own then cranked it, it fires up but then just instantly dies without coughing and the pressing the pedal doesnt help.

I have checked spark and pulled an injector- all is fine and working.

After getting towed home I tried again as the engine was a bit cooler but same thing as above- it fires up easy but dies instantly. I hooked up the laptop and all the guages seem ok, rpm ok and spark advance ok.

Any ideas at all?

Info:
Porsche 1994 911 Turbo CIS Fuel
MSnSE V3 MS1
MT 2.25 with 029s firmware.
VR sensor with 60-2 trigger wheel.
boost junkie
Master MS/Extra'er
Posts: 802
Joined: Tue May 11, 2004 8:58 am
Location: dallas texas usa
Contact:

Post by boost junkie »

Put the MS on a stim and make sure the hardware is still working properly. Perhpas you had some sort of injector or coil driver failure?
Peter Florance
Super MS/Extra'er
Posts: 3653
Joined: Fri Apr 02, 2004 8:40 pm
Location: Virginia Beach, VA
Contact:

First drive in my MSnSe 911 Turbo! But got towed home....

Post by Peter Florance »

check to make sure you have correct injector settings. It will do that if you have high-z injectors, but MS set up for low Z.
Just one possibility

Peter Florance
First Fives.Org - The E12 Registry
1981 Euro BMW 528i w/3.5L & Megasquirt Fuel Injection
1981 US BMW 528i "Repo Car"
http://www.firstfives.org
mailto:peter@firstfives.org (peter@firstfives.org)
ssr# 284

From: Miles965uk [mailto:miles.stovold@edftrading.com]
Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2006 4:06 AM
To: megasquirt-mss@msefi.com
Subject: First drive in my MSnSe 911 Turbo! But got towed home....



After 10 months working on getting MS to run the spark on my '94 911 Turbo... it fired up! I am still using the original fuel CIS system for now.
Many thanks to everyones help esp James & Bill.

I have driving it up and down my street to test it all out and all has been benn fine, So yesterday I took her for a drive and about 10miles into it, it just cut out! A french policeman gave me a helpful push off the road ( Im living in Paris)

So I tried to start again but nothing, if I let the fuel pumps run a bit on their own then cranked it, it fires up but then just instantly dies without coughing and the pressing the pedal doesnt help.

I have checked spark and pulled an injector- all is fine.

After getting towed home I tried again as the engine was a bit cooler but same thing as above- it fires and dies instantly. I hooked up the laptop and all the guages seem ok, rpm ok and spark advance ok.

Any ideas at all?

Info:
Porsche 1994 911 Turbo CIS Fuel
MSnSE V3 MS1
MT 2.25 with 029s firmware.
VR sensor with 60-2 trigger wheel.




----------------------------------------

This post is at:
http://www.msefi.com/viewtopic.php?p=139539#139539

----------------------------------------


Posted by email.
Peter Florance
PF Tuning
81 BMW Euro 528i ESP Car
60-2 Wheel LS2 Coils, Low Z Inj
Co-Driver 1999 BMW E46 DSP car.
Keithg
Super MS/Extra'er
Posts: 2413
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2005 9:15 am
Location: Chicago, IL, USA
Contact:

Post by Keithg »

well, you need compression, fuel and spark to run and you seem to have all 3. The next thing is timing and amount. Verify that the timing is OK on the spark. Could something have moved? You said it sat for a while during the spark install, could the CIS system be giving fuel, but not enough fuel? How about too much (really not too probable unless the flap is locked open). CIS is pretty simple and robust. Could your VB921s be getting too hot? If you are set for generic wheel, wasted spark and MT shows RPM, you should be getting a signal in Next check it on the stim like Shawn says and check spark output as well with leds across the VB921s or some other method (scope, relay). What are your dwell settings?

KeithG
Miles965uk
MS/Extra Newbie
Posts: 16
Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2005 6:18 am

Post by Miles965uk »

Thanks for the responses and help!

Boostjunkie, I will try it on the stim but will have to buy one so it wont be for a short while.
Peter: The coil driver seems to be fine and not overheating.

KeithG: Thanks I will look at the timing when its cranking and when it fires up to see if it doesnt move. I have pulled an injector and tried pressing down on the air flap and the fuel seems to flow fine as it was before.

I have had the car starting and running fine for a few weeks but this was my first long drive.

Im trying to think of this logically because I really believe the fuel is ok, however it really only starts and dies when I pre run the fuel pumps (I guess it builds pressure). But the flapper is not sticking and injectors seem to be ok. I have bridge the fuel pump relay too.

I will check the timing and see to eliminate that. I thought if the injectors were playing up then it would splutter and not die instantly...

I will check a few more things and get back.
hobieboy
Master MS/Extra'er
Posts: 687
Joined: Mon Jun 27, 2005 1:13 pm
Location: Up North

Post by hobieboy »

Miles965uk wrote: Peter: The coil driver seems to be fine and not overheating.
How do you know that the VB921 was not overheating? Reason was - I blew 2 of them when I first tried to start the car and I had a low-tech, inccurate temp sensor sitting beside them to monitor just in case they went hot.

I suggest you measure at least the resistance across the B-E & C-E junctions to make sure its still ok.

When you checked the plugs, did they look ok, i.e. there were sparks & fuel?
Maybe try some new plugs to make sure you still have both fuel & spark.
hobieboy
Master MS/Extra'er
Posts: 687
Joined: Mon Jun 27, 2005 1:13 pm
Location: Up North

Post by hobieboy »

I believe you were running EDIS? If so, can you not disconnect MS completely and let CIS do the fuel, EDIS runs in limp home mode as a test?
Peter Florance
Super MS/Extra'er
Posts: 3653
Joined: Fri Apr 02, 2004 8:40 pm
Location: Virginia Beach, VA
Contact:

First drive in my MSnSe 911 Turbo! But got towed home....

Post by Peter Florance »

actually I was thinking the opposite problem.
If you use 'peak-hold', meant for low injectors, on high z injectors, they may not stay open except during cranking


Peter Florance
First Fives.Org - The E12 Registry
1981 Euro BMW 528i w/3.5L & Megasquirt Fuel Injection
1981 US BMW 528i "Repo Car"
http://www.firstfives.org
mailto:peter@firstfives.org (peter@firstfives.org)
ssr# 284
-----Original Message-----
From: Miles965uk [mailto:miles.stovold@edftrading.com]
Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2006 9:07 AM
To: megasquirt-mss@msefi.com
Subject: First drive in my MSnSe 911 Turbo! But got towed home....


Thanks for the responses and help!

Boostjunkie, I will try it on the stim but will have to buy one so it wont be for a short while.
Peter: The coil driver seems to be fine and not overheating.

KeithG: Thanks I will look at the timing when its cranking and when it fires up to see if it doesnt move. I have pulled an injector and tried pressing down on the air flap and the fuel seems to flow fine as it was before.

I have had the car starting and running fine for a few weeks but this was my first long drive.

Im trying to think of this logically because I really believe the fuel is ok, however it really only starts and dies when I pre run the fuel pumps (I guess it builds pressure). But the flapper is not sticking and injectors seem to be ok. I have bridge the fuel pump relay too.

I will check the timing and see to eliminate that. I thought if the injectors were playing up then it would splutter and not die instantly...

I will check a few more things and get back.




----------------------------------------

This post is at:
http://www.msefi.com/viewtopic.php?p=139564#139564

----------------------------------------
Posted by email.
Peter Florance
PF Tuning
81 BMW Euro 528i ESP Car
60-2 Wheel LS2 Coils, Low Z Inj
Co-Driver 1999 BMW E46 DSP car.
Miles965uk
MS/Extra Newbie
Posts: 16
Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2005 6:18 am

Post by Miles965uk »

Ok just for more info:
The CIS and the injectors are not EFi or run by MS and the injectors are run constanly by the air plunger.

I am using the stock dizzy still and with one VB291, I will test to see the resistance for the overheating but it sparked fine.

I will try and fire it up tonight to see what happens.
Peter Florance
Super MS/Extra'er
Posts: 3653
Joined: Fri Apr 02, 2004 8:40 pm
Location: Virginia Beach, VA
Contact:

First drive in my MSnSe 911 Turbo! But got towed home....

Post by Peter Florance »

Oh then disregard my advice on injectors. ):


It's possible if the dwell is too long the VB921 can overheat and shut down?



Peter Florance
First Fives.Org - The E12 Registry
1981 Euro BMW 528i w/3.5L & Megasquirt Fuel Injection
1981 US BMW 528i "Repo Car"
http://www.firstfives.org
mailto:peter@firstfives.org (peter@firstfives.org)
ssr# 284
-----Original Message-----
From: Miles965uk [mailto:miles.stovold@edftrading.com]
Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2006 10:49 AM
To: megasquirt-mss@msefi.com
Subject: First drive in my MSnSe 911 Turbo! But got towed home....


Ok just for more info:
The CIS and the injectors are not EFi or run by MS and the injectors are run constanly by the air plunger.

I am using the stock dizzy still and with one VB291, I will test to see the resistance for the overheating but it sparked fine.

I will try and fire it up tonight to see what happens.




----------------------------------------

This post is at:
http://www.msefi.com/viewtopic.php?p=139596#139596

----------------------------------------
Posted by email.
Peter Florance
PF Tuning
81 BMW Euro 528i ESP Car
60-2 Wheel LS2 Coils, Low Z Inj
Co-Driver 1999 BMW E46 DSP car.
Miles965uk
MS/Extra Newbie
Posts: 16
Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2005 6:18 am

Post by Miles965uk »

ok so problem fixed!
I wasnt MS either, I had an air leak form the rubber elbow joint. Put it back and Im back on track!

Thanks for the help!
Big Creek
Helpful MS/Extra'er
Posts: 139
Joined: Tue May 18, 2004 4:55 pm
Location: Victor Montana

Post by Big Creek »

Dang CIS injection!! Just one more reason to finish the conversion to EFI! :)

Todd
1979 Porsche 924, 2.0L 4cyl, 1.6L Whipple SuperCharger, MS-I V2.2, MJLJ, MSnS 029q2
Miles965uk
MS/Extra Newbie
Posts: 16
Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2005 6:18 am

Post by Miles965uk »

Oh yes!
I would but ive just bought a new twin turbo engine to pop in. Its already all EFi with a remap ECU from RS tuning.
I think I will give it a tune with MS tho.
Post Reply