Somebody use (fixed)

[olivier16s]

hello

After a lot of trail, I don't know what to do.
I cannot syn the MS2 when cranking.
It is working fine with jimstim, not in the car.
With LM1815, I can cranking but not go above 3500tr.
With the VR pcb V3, I have a good signal but noting.
See below the signal and the renix wheell


the signal is veriy clean...





The renix mode is 44-2-2. But we can see 1 big teeth and -1 small...in fact -2.. but with a spike between the 2..

What do you thonk ??? Any ideas ???

Thank you !!

[jsmcortina]

This wheel mode has been used and is working as far as I know.

Perhaps try inverting the input capture edge when using the V3 conditioner?

James

[olivier16s]

ok, I will test....

Is it possible to change resistor (1K input) to have a better signal ?

thanks

[terrastudios]

Hey

I've got this wheel working fine (thanks to James) on a Renault F7P engine which looks like it uses the same flywheel configuration. I'm using a standard V3 PCB.

22 base teeth
2nd trigger off
Trigger position A = 3
Trigger return = 11
Trigger angle = 65
Cranking timing = time based

Hope this helps

Matt

[olivier16s]

Hey

I've got this wheel working fine (thanks to James) on a Renault F7P engine which looks like it uses the same flywheel configuration. I'm using a standard V3 PCB.

22 base teeth
2nd trigger off
Trigger position A = 3
Trigger return = 11
Trigger angle = 65
Cranking timing = time based

Hope this helps

Matt

Hello

ok, but what is the firmware using ? is it MS2 ?

Have you modify the V3 PCB ?

thank you

[jsmcortina]

That is for MS1/Extra. But your question about V3 board mods remains valid.

Do some searches on 44-2-2 and there are other guys using it on MS2/Extra for sure.

James

[olivier16s]

That is for MS1/Extra. But your question about V3 board mods remains valid.

Do some searches on 44-2-2 and there are other guys using it on MS2/Extra for sure.

James

OK, Its is cranking now but I cant go above 3000tr/min. I have the same problem with LM1815 circuit....
I'am trying...

thanks

[terrastudios]

Hi

Sorry didnt notice you were using MS2, the above settings are for MS1. V3 board is standard.

If you post your msq I'll take a look as now using car with MS2.

Cheers

Matt

[olivier16s]

Hi

Sorry didnt notice you were using MS2, the above settings are for MS1. V3 board is standard.

If you post your msq I'll take a look as now using car with MS2.

Cheers

Matt

Hi,

Please found the msq.
I have the renix ignition module, original sensors (vr clt ...)

thanks

[terrastudios]

Hi

Sorry for delay in getting back to you, I finally got chance to take a look at the msq you posted. Why is your trigger angle set to -90? I thought this was usually around 60?

Thanks

Matt

[olivier16s]

Hi

Sorry for delay in getting back to you, I finally got chance to take a look at the msq you posted. Why is your trigger angle set to -90? I thought this was usually around 60?

Thanks

Matt

Hello

I Have read it on a renault notice. It is working with that. You are around 60 !!!??
I have to continue the tests,

Can you give me your configuration ?

thanks

[terrastudios]

Hi

My msq is on the other laptop; I'll try and post it as soon as I can.

Have you verified the -90 using a timing light? I attempted to use this as a value and we were getting flames through the throttle bodies (it was sooo advanced!). I've verified using a timing light that the trigger angle should be around 55. We painted a white mark on the flywheel so that you can see it through the gap in the JB3 gearbox housing (next to the VR sensor) at TDC, which is where the missing teeth are. I set the Megasquirt to a fixed 10 degree advance and started it up and altered the trigger angle until the white mark and the timing light matched.

I'm very confused why your engine is running on -90, I've got a F7P (Renault 19 16V) - only thing I can think of is your VR sensor is mounted in a different place than mine?

I had limited success with the VR-sensor circuit on the V3 and MSII, so I'm now using a LM1815 conditioner (pin 14 is grounded) and get a clean signal (much like your above scope traces), this goes directly to the IRQ pin of the MSII processor, so its not inverted by the opto.

I have got a slight issue where it looses sync occasionally, but I'm hoping the noise filtering options will remove this problem.

I've not yet found anyone thats succesfully running on these engines (a few I've talked to have given up), so its good to know someone else is attempting it!

Matt

[olivier16s]

Hi

My msq is on the other laptop; I'll try and post it as soon as I can.

Have you verified the -90 using a timing light? I attempted to use this as a value and we were getting flames through the throttle bodies (it was sooo advanced!). I've verified using a timing light that the trigger angle should be around 55. We painted a white mark on the flywheel so that you can see it through the gap in the JB3 gearbox housing (next to the VR sensor) at TDC, which is where the missing teeth are. I set the Megasquirt to a fixed 10 degree advance and started it up and altered the trigger angle until the white mark and the timing light matched.

I'm very confused why your engine is running on -90, I've got a F7P (Renault 19 16V) - only thing I can think of is your VR sensor is mounted in a different place than mine?

I had limited success with the VR-sensor circuit on the V3 and MSII, so I'm now using a LM1815 conditioner and get a clean signal (much like your above scope traces), this goes directly to the IRQ pin of the MSII processor, so its not inverted by the opto.

I have got a slight issue where it looses sync occasionally, but I'm hoping the noise filtering options will remove this problem.

I've not yet found anyone thats succesfully running on these engines (a few I've talked to have given up), so its good to know someone else is attempting it!

Matt

It is very stange. because the Vr sensor is at 11 teeth of the missing teeth when on the TDC.
So 360°/44*11=90... we have + or - 90° because the 2 missing teeth.

[terrastudios]

I'll have a think about this flywheel teeth problem in a moment, thanks for the picture.

These are the scope traces I took of the VR sensor with the LM1815

This is with pin 14 grounded


This is without pin 14 grounded (note VR polarity was wrong in this as well)


Seems to make a big difference.

This is a diagram I've found of the clio/19 flywheel arrangement (not sure if you've seen this before)


I've modified it to support your suggested 90 degree trigger angle (and it makes sense to the diagram), I just wonder why its different on the car?

[olivier16s]

I'll have a think about this flywheel teeth problem in a moment, thanks for the picture.

These are the scope traces I took of the VR sensor with the LM1815

This is with pin 14 grounded


This is without pin 14 grounded (note VR polarity was wrong in this as well)


Seems to make a big difference.

This is a diagram I've found of the clio/19 flywheel arrangement (not sure if you've seen this before)


I've modified it to support your suggested 90 degree trigger angle (and it makes sense to the diagram), I just wonder why its different on the car?

Are you using MS2 ?
What are your megatune setting ?
Are you inverting the LM1815 signal ?
Please give me more info to intersetand... I'm lost !

[terrastudios]

Hi,

I'm using a V3 MS2 board running the latest extra beta code, and a LM1815 conditoner board (with pin 14 grounded), the output of which is not inverted. I'm using a standard coil via a Bosch 139 ignitor module, which I think is the reason why I'm running at 60 degrees trigger angle and you are not. Are you using the standard Renault ignition module or a VB921?

Thanks again

Matt

[olivier16s]

hi

thank you

I'm using the standard renault ignition module. But my lm1815 is inverted...
but I cannot got above 3000 tr (synchr loss). I will try your config, but I'm changing the camshaft... so I'll try next week.

I keep you inform.


thanks again.

[olivier16s]

Hi,

I'm using a V3 MS2 board running the latest extra beta code, and a LM1815 conditoner board, the output of which is not inverted. I'm using a standard coil via a Bosch 139 ignitor module, which I think is the reason why I'm running at 60 degrees trigger angle and you are not. Are you using the standard Renault ignition module or a VB921?

Thanks again

Matt

could you upload your .msq ?
Just to see the other setting.

thanks

[terrastudios]

Hi

No problem; just to let you know I got the engine to rev to 6000rpm over the weekend (it sounds awesome as I'm running GSXR750 throttle bodies).

Do you have a wiring diagram for the Siemens ignition module is? (http://www.lambdasensor02.com/%5CProduc ... PC8104.jpg) I believe there are two white plugs but I do not know which is +12V, GND or which is ignition trigger. I am using a bosch ignitor (139 from a Saab) with a standard coil but would like to use the standard ignition module if possible.

Thanks again

Matt

[olivier16s]

Hi

No problem; just to let you know I got the engine to rev to 6000rpm over the weekend (it sounds awesome as I'm running GSXR750 throttle bodies).

Do you have a wiring diagram for the Siemens ignition module is? (http://www.lambdasensor02.com/%5CProduc ... PC8104.jpg) I believe there are two white plugs but I do not know which is +12V, GND or which is ignition trigger. I am using a bosch ignitor (139 from a Saab) with a standard coil but would like to use the standard ignition module if possible.

Thanks again

Matt

Yes, there is two plug. one wtih 3 connector, the other with 2.
The fisrt plug A : 1 + (A), 2 - (B) , 3 tacho (C)
the second B : in from mega (0-5V) (B)

The signal is 0-5V with 4.2ms of time duration. I'm wired directly from the MSII and set up in "going high".

The picture is from the old renix ingnition module, I have just modified for look like the new.

regards