Need Help Misfire under load (w/boost) with MS2 and EDIS 8

[undfetd]

Hello,
I am new on the forum, but not to Megasquirt. I have a build consisting of a Ford 4.6L, 4 valve V-8 motor with a TT set-up, using the factory COP ignition with an MS2 and an EDIS 8. The car runs perfect at all points except under WOT and heavy load (ocurring between 5-7K RPM) at around 17-20 psi. The car will surge and pop strongly/ "breaking up" baddly as if it were running out of fuel or spark, causing the blow off valves to vent aggressively. I have tried different EDIS 8 modules, and put on all new coils, with no real improvement. The MS2 AFR is where I command it and so is the ignition timing. The only thing that seems to have helped is gapping my NGK TR7 plugs down to .018", but still breaks up intermittently under load. I am using a shielded cable for PIP and SAW wires, and all grounds seem to be solid. I resently tied in an MSD boost a spark box in-line to the coil supply wires with no improvement. Any trouble shooting suggestions or different settings to use with the EDIS 8 would be appreciated, I am at my wit's end.

Thank You,
Sergio

[DaveEFI]

Is the EDIS8 driving COP the factory setup?

[undfetd]

Yes, the EDIS 8 is running the COPs.

[elutionsdesign]

Well, since dropping the plug gap helped I'd follow that line of thinking and increase the coil dwell. Except you don't have control of that, EDIS does. So to provide another level of tuning I'd get rid of the EDIS module and pick up two QuadSpark coil drivers from DIYautotune, then modify your MS2 for four ignition outputs. Wire it for wasted spark like the EDIS was doing but now you have control of the coils. You can still run your boost-a-spark if you think its helping.

[DaveEFI]

Seems odd that's needed if if the EDIS8 module/COP was what the factory fitted?

[jsmcortina]

Seems odd that's needed if if the EDIS8 module/COP was what the factory fitted?

As far as I'm aware, there are no factory EDIS8/COP installs. The way I read the original post is that OEM COPs were used with an MS2 and an EDIS8 module (from a different vehicle.)

James

[Matt Cramer]

As far as I'm aware, there are no factory EDIS8/COP installs. The way I read the original post is that OEM COPs were used with an MS2 and an EDIS8 module (from a different vehicle.)

James

That's how I read it too. Are the coils wired in parallel or series?

[ol boy]

This guy is having the same issue.
http://www.bangshift.com/forum/forum/ba ... l-settings

Found an other forum post where if wiring the coils in parallel will burn up the EDIS8 module and running them in series will cause weakish spark.

Ditching the EDIS 8 module and building an 8 coil driver board with the right waste spark firing order will be your best bet. You will loose some IO though as you will need Js10, D14,D15,D16 for spark outputs.

[DaveEFI]

Seems odd that's needed if if the EDIS8 module/COP was what the factory fitted?

As far as I'm aware, there are no factory EDIS8/COP installs. The way I read the original post is that OEM COPs were used with an MS2 and an EDIS8 module (from a different vehicle.)

James

Ah - that's why I asked. I'd never heard of EDIS using COP. But of course it could work ok if the 2 COP are identical to a single EDIS coil.

[undfetd]

Well, since dropping the plug gap helped I'd follow that line of thinking and increase the coil dwell. Except you don't have control of that, EDIS does. So to provide another level of tuning I'd get rid of the EDIS module and pick up two QuadSpark coil drivers from DIYautotune, then modify your MS2 for four ignition outputs. Wire it for wasted spark like the EDIS was doing but now you have control of the coils. You can still run your boost-a-spark if you think its helping.

Thank you for the response, this is what I was trying to figure out. I also don't have any experiense w/ MS 3, I was told the MS 3 could run the COPs without the drivers. Is this true? If so would it be less wiring work or more economical this way? Or stick to the quad spark mod to the MS 2?

[undfetd]

As far as I'm aware, there are no factory EDIS8/COP installs. The way I read the original post is that OEM COPs were used with an MS2 and an EDIS8 module (from a different vehicle.)

James

That's how I read it too. Are the coils wired in parallel or series?

This is correct. I am using the EDIS 8, from a 96' Ford (OEM used with (2) 4-output coil packs) on an 03 Ford Cobra/ terminator COP motor.

[jsmcortina]

MS3 needs a driver for high-current coils. So you still need drivers either way. MS3 would allow you to run them fully sequential if you add a cam sensor.

James

[undfetd]

This guy is having the same issue.
http://www.bangshift.com/forum/forum/ba ... l-settings

Found an other forum post where if wiring the coils in parallel will burn up the EDIS8 module and running them in series will cause weakish spark.

Ditching the EDIS 8 module and building an 8 coil driver board with the right waste spark firing order will be your best bet. You will loose some IO though as you will need Js10, D14,D15,D16 for spark outputs.

Great info in that article. Thank you. And I do run them in a series, so that may further explain my problem. The way I have it now may work for n.a. applcations, but not for forced induction.

[undfetd]

MS3 needs a driver for high-current coils. So you still need drivers either way. MS3 would allow you to run them fully sequential if you add a cam sensor.

James

Thanks James, that is very helpful. How many outputs will the two drivers I need require? I'm currently all used up, is my MS 2 capable of further output slot expansion? If so what part would I need?

Thank you.
Sergio

[DaveEFI]

I'd either change to EDIS coils with the EDIS 8 driver, or change to MS drivers with your COP. The latter allows you to adjust the dwell etc, which EDIS doesn't.

[dontz125]

Thanks James, that is very helpful. How many outputs will the two drivers I need require? I'm currently all used up, is my MS 2 capable of further output slot expansion? If so what part would I need?

To fire 8 cylinders in wasted spark, you'll need 4 channels - D14, D16, D15, and JS11. What other circuitry beyond that will be determined by your COP selection, whether logic or dumb (high-current). Since you are using JS10 for EDIS, that will be freed up. If those pins are already in use for other functions, you may want to consider a Tiny-IOx by jbperf.

Note that you'll also need to rewire your TachSelect and TSel to use the VR components, as the MS will now be reading the 36-1 wheel directly.