Edis-8 coil packs vs cops

[matt222]

Hey guys brand new to the forum and to megasquirt.
I'm going to be using ms as a stand alone ecu in my 2000 4.6 2v mustang. Motor is fully forged, custom grind cams, trick flow heads, kenne bell 2.6 at 20lbs with meth through a built th400.
Over the last few days I've done hours of research on ms. It looks like I have 2 options to power the ignition but I have some questions and concerns.
1) an edis-8 to power 2 coil packs and run plugs and wires. Seems to be the easiest option but I'm really trying to keep the engine bay clean and clutter free. I'm not even sure if the 98-96 plug wires will fit down into the head of a 99-04.
2) an edis-8 to power the 8 coil over plugs. This would be ideal keep everything neat and clean and I already have msd cops in the car. My only concern is I have read people are having issues with weak spark. I have also heard people running 2 edis-8 in parallel to bump up the power a bit.



So I started looking for an alternative to the edis-8 and I came across this from msd http://www.msdperformance.com/Products/ ... /5_4L.aspx

Has anyone used one of these with megasquirt? Seems like it would solve the lack of power from the edis problem. Any input or advise is appreciate. Thankyou

[dontz125]

Hi, Matt - welcome to the madness!

If you don't already have an EDIS installed, I wouldn't bother. Whether you go with a MS2 or MS3, you can drive the dumb COPs you were looking at with 2 QuadSparkmodules with the MS controlling spark advance, dwell, rev limiting, and more. If you source a set of logic-level coils (with built-in ignitors), you don't even need the QuadSpark units.

[matt222]

Thankyou for your help. Ill look into the quad spark further.

Is it possible to retard the timing with a 12v trigger using quad spark and ms? My water meth setup is run through a safe inject that monitors the flow and if there's a problem it sends 12v to trigger to retard timing.

I have a j&s safegaurd that I was going to use before I decided to run ms. It has knock control and also takes the 12v trigger wire that retards timing. I could always use this if I can't do it with ms.

[billr]

I'm pretty sure MS can handle that safety function, and many more related to boosting. There is no need for extra boxes/controllers like the MSD and that safety thingy anymore, all that can be handled by the MS and things kept (relatively) simple. The Quad Spark is certainly a good way to fire "dumb" coils, whether COP or remote coils, but there are cheaper ways to do it if you do a bit of soldering. DIYautotune offers the BIP373 coil-driver for under $10 each, so a "quad" would be $40. That is a trivial savings over the Quad Spark, I think, but some people will opt for an MS2 rather than the MS3 just to save $106; so you never know...

[Laminar]

but I'm really trying to keep the engine bay clean and clutter free.

If this is your ultimate goal, get some LS coils and build your own plug wires. That's what I did on my Ford 5.0 build. The LS coils have built in ignitors so that the MS3X can drive eight coils directly with no extra devices in between. I got a set of eight used truck coils with brackets and harnesses on eBay for $100. You can get the "good" coils with built in heat sinks for a bit more.

You can get LS coil ends and 8mm silicone wire from Summit, I don't know what your plug ends look like, but I have to believe there's something out there that will work for you.

[matt222]

too many options my head is starting to spin.

[Laminar]

Count EDIS out, it limits you more than it helps you.

Now you just need to choose between using Ford COPs with one QuadSpark (for wasted spark) or two for sequential, or using LS coils driven directly by the MS.

I suppose it matters which MS you're looking at - MS2, MS3, MS3+MS3X?

[matt222]

Thanks for the help guys I appreciate it. Since I have already spent the money for the msd cops I will stick with those.

Money aside Is there a big advantage to running 2 quadsparks and controlling all 8 of the cops rather than a wasted spark setup?

[elutionsdesign]

Money aside Is there a big advantage to running 2 quadsparks and controlling all 8 of the cops rather than a wasted spark setup?

Probably not.

[dontz125]

There is one thing I've read from a few guys, and that's backfiring under boost. Depending on your cam timing, spark timing and boost levels, apparently the wasted spark can set off the incoming charge. COP would prevent this.

[R100RT]

I can attest to what Don has mentioned above.
Empirical evidence perhaps but with a boxer twin on wasted spark I had carbon tracts up the inlet, and a reduced power issue.
With sequential ignition (& COP), that all cleaned up and instant improvement in power. My cam overlap perhaps not ideal but I'm sold on sequential.