[FW MOD] ms2extra 3.3.0b gslender v2.4.4

This is a forum for discussing the development and testing of alpha MS2/Extra code. Documentation
(Runs on MS2 and Microsquirt)

Moderators: jsmcortina, muythaibxr

Re: [FW MOD] ms2extra 3.3.0b gslender v2.4.4

Postby msegt » Sun Mar 18, 2012 6:46 pm

i switched back to normal B it ran too weird, and had a hard start when i was test driving it, this is the first one i had to do this with, oh well....lol... i just went backwards and played with my pid settings for something to do...lol...sorry forgot a log maybe ill try it again my next free day though...i did notice i couldnt get the idle test to work this time either, no matter where i set the test it sat at about 2500 ish
95 escort gt BPT - MS2E/ms2extra pre3.3alpha5 gslender v2.8 - E85 - 256/250 on mustang dyno at 10psi, now tuning for gtr turbo
msegt
Helpful MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 81
Joined: Fri Jan 15, 2010 10:10 pm
Location: boston,ny

Re: [FW MOD] ms2extra 3.3.0b gslender v2.4.4

Postby gslender » Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:20 pm

msegt wrote:i switched back to normal B it ran too weird, and had a hard start when i was test driving it, this is the first one i had to do this with, oh well....lol... i just went backwards and played with my pid settings for something to do...lol...sorry forgot a log maybe ill try it again my next free day though...i did notice i couldnt get the idle test to work this time either, no matter where i set the test it sat at about 2500 ish



Was this running the fixed 2.4.4 code I published a day ago? Or did you download a previous release?

G
Mazda MX5 + MS3 Pro
User avatar
gslender
Super MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 1072
Joined: Fri Sep 16, 2011 5:29 am
Location: Brisbane, Australia

Re: [FW MOD] ms2extra 3.3.0b gslender v2.4.4

Postby msegt » Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:25 pm

i went back to whats in my sig
95 escort gt BPT - MS2E/ms2extra pre3.3alpha5 gslender v2.8 - E85 - 256/250 on mustang dyno at 10psi, now tuning for gtr turbo
msegt
Helpful MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 81
Joined: Fri Jan 15, 2010 10:10 pm
Location: boston,ny

Re: [FW MOD] ms2extra 3.3.0b gslender v2.4.4

Postby gslender » Sun Mar 18, 2012 8:09 pm

msegt wrote:i went back to whats in my sig


I really wanted to know what version of the MOD you tried - just making sure it was the current version (2.4.4) as I only updated it a few days ago.

No issues should exist, and if you've seen problems I'd reallyl like to know what - can you send me ya MSQ so that I can at least see what you are trying to run with, and perhaps explain a little more clearly what the issues are - eg. you said it was hard starting... what does that mean? as you can turn off every single new feature, so it should have just run the same ???? :?

G
Mazda MX5 + MS3 Pro
User avatar
gslender
Super MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 1072
Joined: Fri Sep 16, 2011 5:29 am
Location: Brisbane, Australia

Re: [FW MOD] ms2extra 3.3.0b gslender v2.4.4

Postby msegt » Sun Mar 18, 2012 8:17 pm

oh oh sorry...lol. i tried this latest version 2.4.4 i started with your settings for now since its a pretty similar car . i messed around for an hour, i gave up after i got the hard start at the store. i just flashed it back when i got home and its back to normal its been fine since. im free after i run around tomarrow ill mess with it more then probably , ill get logs too this time.
95 escort gt BPT - MS2E/ms2extra pre3.3alpha5 gslender v2.8 - E85 - 256/250 on mustang dyno at 10psi, now tuning for gtr turbo
msegt
Helpful MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 81
Joined: Fri Jan 15, 2010 10:10 pm
Location: boston,ny

Re: [FW MOD] ms2extra 3.3.0b gslender v2.4.4

Postby gslender » Sun Mar 18, 2012 9:29 pm

msegt wrote:i started with your settings for now since its a pretty similar car


you mean you loaded the 2.4.4 firmware and used my MSQ hoping it would work?? if not, what of "my settings" did you use?

g
Mazda MX5 + MS3 Pro
User avatar
gslender
Super MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 1072
Joined: Fri Sep 16, 2011 5:29 am
Location: Brisbane, Australia

Re: [FW MOD] ms2extra 3.3.0b gslender v2.4.4

Postby msegt » Sun Mar 18, 2012 9:34 pm

no i used my msq and started off with your iavc and what ever was listed above that , and what ever else was changed, ive been doing it since i tried your firmware mods and its been great. i tried the settings it started with too but ill mess with it more another day im not worried its probably just a settings i just got s*** to do in the morning so i didnt wanna deal with it tomarrow till thats done...lol...
95 escort gt BPT - MS2E/ms2extra pre3.3alpha5 gslender v2.8 - E85 - 256/250 on mustang dyno at 10psi, now tuning for gtr turbo
msegt
Helpful MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 81
Joined: Fri Jan 15, 2010 10:10 pm
Location: boston,ny

Re: [FW MOD] ms2extra 3.3.0b gslender v2.4.4

Postby msegt » Mon Mar 19, 2012 12:32 am

i think half the problem was i tried the lower tpsdot threshold from your tune, i thaught i did that the day before though, im gonna try it again tomarrow and ill let ya know. apparently my tpsdot needs smoothing from false triggers, i put it back to 80 and all is well.... hopefully it was just that, it didnt do it when i shut it off last im not sure why it started again, i went back to a restore point from the 15th and im gonna start over again.... i saved the tune i used today so im just going to change that back to 80 on there and hope thats all it was
95 escort gt BPT - MS2E/ms2extra pre3.3alpha5 gslender v2.8 - E85 - 256/250 on mustang dyno at 10psi, now tuning for gtr turbo
msegt
Helpful MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 81
Joined: Fri Jan 15, 2010 10:10 pm
Location: boston,ny

Re: [FW MOD] ms2extra 3.3.0b gslender v2.4.4

Postby Greg G » Mon Mar 19, 2012 5:04 am

OK time to get this topic back on track with firmware development and not individual tuning issues :P

While I already raved about the excellent effect of the oversampled and averaged TPS data on TPSdot, the addition of robs' moving anchor filter resulted in a flat noise-free TPSdot line, at 100 lag factor (no lag filter applied). It's so flat it's creepy. But it is very responsive to throttle movements. Should allow even finer tuning of AE. There are no spikes to cause false triggers :shock: Compare it to MAPdot, which has only the oversampling/averaging done, also at 100 lag factor, but no robs filter. Perhaps MAPdot can get the same treatment in the future?

Image

The 5 point curve for adaptive PID is really allowing me to tune an asymmetrical response, more aggressive below target. This keeps the idle valve relatively quiet when within a small band around the target RPM...
Image

This goes hand in hand with AIA, also more aggressive below target. Again, AIA is better for fine tuning near target because of its immediate and fine response, compared to the slower/coarser response of the idle valve.
Image

I am on the fence with the adaptive voltage correction. It does allow a more rapid and transient response to voltage droops. My analogy would be a more "D" type response, as opposed to a more "P" like response from the old voltage correction. I would like the battery target calculations to exclude large dips from the baseline somehow, to get a larger separation. As it is though, I would say both are equally good and the decision on which to use would depend on the particular car/user. But it's good to have the 2 options. I will try to spend some more time tuning the adaptive voltage correction in the next few days.

Image
1996 Mazda MX-5 1.6L NA6/ Mazdaspeed M45 SC/ BSP AW Intercooler/ Maruha F-cams/ 425cc RX-8 injectors/ DIYPNP

MS2/Extra test mule :)
Greg G
Experienced MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 311
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2011 11:33 pm

Re: [FW MOD] ms2extra 3.3.0b gslender v2.4.4

Postby bubba2533 » Mon Mar 19, 2012 5:28 am

Greg G wrote:Image


That looks so good, I almost wish i didn't upgrade to MS3 yet.
97 Subaru Impreza 2.2L - MS3 w/ MS3/x
bubba2533
Experienced MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 340
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2009 6:12 pm

Re: [FW MOD] ms2extra 3.3.0b gslender v2.4.4

Postby Zaphod » Mon Mar 19, 2012 5:37 am

Hopefully those filter things get moved on to MS3!
--------------------------------
fun is not a straight line

Image

Sven
http://www.mx-5club-sachsen.de
http://miata.cardomain.com/id/svenmx5
NB-1998-1,6-Garrett T25 HGP Turbo Stage I
Zaphod
Experienced MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 304
Joined: Thu Aug 14, 2008 11:38 pm
Location: Germany

Re: [FW MOD] ms2extra 3.3.0b gslender v2.4.4

Postby LT401Vette » Mon Mar 19, 2012 7:10 am

gslender wrote:For example, Phil posted this a while back in resposne to a similar question about another firmware built by MarioB
It needs to start with these to be identified as MS2e 3.x in TS 1.004:
MS2Extra Rel 3
MS2Extra Serial
MS2Extra serial

For future I can add the pattern "MS2Extra 3" in the next beta to support as it is..


The serial signature in 2.4.4 is...
"MS2Extra Ser GSv24 "

and the alpha released 3.3.0b is...
"MS2Extra Serial330b"

So I guess I stuffed it and can change it back... but doesn't leave much room for version numbers etc....

I'll ask Phil to focus on something less if possible...

G


There are 2 cures for this... The reason TS is looking at so much of the signature is that it has to identify not just that it is MS2Extra, but the version as well because the older version don't support all the loggers.
but that is easily fixed by using a different pattern.

But also, this may be the better solution. To support the new MS3 MAP logger I have now made it read the Logger Definition from the ini file in a section called:
[LoggerDefinition]
I have not put together the entries needed to reproduce the current ignition loggers or tested them yet. But if I do that, then you can just add them to the ini file and the signature won't matter any more...
Phil Tobin
EFI Analytics, helping to simplify EFI
Next Generation tuning software.
Supporting all MegaSquirt versions and firmwares.
http://www.TunerStudio.com
http://www.efiAnalytics.com/MegaLogViewer/
Support the firmware running your engine:
http://www.msextra.com/doc/donations.html
User avatar
LT401Vette
Super MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 8186
Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2005 8:07 am
Location: Moorseville, NC

Re: [FW MOD] ms2extra 3.3.0b gslender v2.4.4

Postby BenGTT » Mon Mar 19, 2012 8:39 am

Well, it is incredible how better MS2 is now with all your work guys. It is so much faster, easier and repetability is very very good from a similar car to another one.

Thanks !
BenGTT
Master MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 387
Joined: Sun Nov 23, 2008 4:46 am
Location: France

Re: [FW MOD] ms2extra 3.3.0b gslender v2.4.4

Postby pigga » Mon Mar 19, 2012 10:46 am

BenGTT wrote:Well, it is incredible how better MS2 is now with all your work guys. It is so much faster, easier and repetability is very very good from a similar car to another one.

Thanks !


Yepp, never had expected such results from some signal conditioning.
I would like to ask a question in this context. What do the experts think: I noticed, that with 60-2wheel I had slight "jitter" on the rpm signal that I had never seen with stock hall sensor inside the distributor (which is a 2-tooth wheel if you wanna see it that way).
So...should the RPM sliding window size be related to the number of teeth? A 60-2 tooth wheel needs larger window than a 36-1 wheel for instance? And a stock distributor as mentioned above needs no RPM smoothing at all?
I am supposing this because the higher the number of teeth the more often the RPM signal will be updated. Am I thinking into the right direction?
Thomas
pigga
Master MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 596
Joined: Sat Feb 09, 2008 12:44 pm
Location: Germany

Re: [FW MOD] ms2extra 3.3.0b gslender v2.4.4

Postby msegt » Mon Mar 19, 2012 1:48 pm

put 2.4.4 back on and its back to normal again, now i know i went to low with the tps threshold oh well live and learn....lol... not sure why it didnt effect it till the 2nd drive though...
95 escort gt BPT - MS2E/ms2extra pre3.3alpha5 gslender v2.8 - E85 - 256/250 on mustang dyno at 10psi, now tuning for gtr turbo
msegt
Helpful MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 81
Joined: Fri Jan 15, 2010 10:10 pm
Location: boston,ny

Re: [FW MOD] ms2extra 3.3.0b gslender v2.4.4

Postby gslender » Mon Mar 19, 2012 2:05 pm

LT401Vette wrote:I have not put together the entries needed to reproduce the current ignition loggers or tested them yet. But if I do that, then you can just add them to the ini file and the signature won't matter any more...


Well that would be great.

Until then people can just change the signature in the ini (of 2.4.4) to be any of the above and it will work (but TS will complain the project ini and firmware are mismatched - just ignore and continue).

At least until either Phil updates TS to use the new ini entries and/or I update the signature of the next mod build - I will try and remember to stay within the current TS guidelines.

G
Mazda MX5 + MS3 Pro
User avatar
gslender
Super MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 1072
Joined: Fri Sep 16, 2011 5:29 am
Location: Brisbane, Australia

Re: [FW MOD] ms2extra 3.3.0b gslender v2.4.4

Postby msegt » Mon Mar 19, 2012 4:23 pm

that sig fixed works perfect, thanks i have diagnostics back, i didnt get an error either, maybe when i plug it into the car again, but diagnostics isnt greyed out anymore... i just used the signature from 3.3.0b and reopened TS
95 escort gt BPT - MS2E/ms2extra pre3.3alpha5 gslender v2.8 - E85 - 256/250 on mustang dyno at 10psi, now tuning for gtr turbo
msegt
Helpful MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 81
Joined: Fri Jan 15, 2010 10:10 pm
Location: boston,ny

Re: [FW MOD] ms2extra 3.3.0b gslender v2.4.4

Postby LT401Vette » Mon Mar 19, 2012 4:29 pm

Yes ts should certainly complain.

The next beta should be out in the next day or 2, just tying up a couple loose ends.
there are a lot of changes in this release
Phil Tobin
EFI Analytics, helping to simplify EFI
Next Generation tuning software.
Supporting all MegaSquirt versions and firmwares.
http://www.TunerStudio.com
http://www.efiAnalytics.com/MegaLogViewer/
Support the firmware running your engine:
http://www.msextra.com/doc/donations.html
User avatar
LT401Vette
Super MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 8186
Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2005 8:07 am
Location: Moorseville, NC

Re: [FW MOD] ms2extra 3.3.0b gslender v2.4.4

Postby msegt » Mon Mar 19, 2012 4:37 pm

sounds good, ill keep an eye out thanks again
95 escort gt BPT - MS2E/ms2extra pre3.3alpha5 gslender v2.8 - E85 - 256/250 on mustang dyno at 10psi, now tuning for gtr turbo
msegt
Helpful MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 81
Joined: Fri Jan 15, 2010 10:10 pm
Location: boston,ny

Re: [FW MOD] ms2extra 3.3.0b gslender v2.4.4

Postby piledriver » Tue Mar 20, 2012 12:28 am

Loaded 3.30b-2.44 a few days ago, no complaints, has never run so well.
Turned on the TPS filter, much better, may be able to finally tune accells again.
(~200 miles on it so far)

OTOH, with just EAE turned on(baseline settings) the drivability is perfect with the VE map nailed down.
Only the WB tells me I get a fast lean spike... It doesn't fall over when I stomp it.

Had a minor related issue while warming up with idle slowing/stalls, once I got a chance to play with it I just had to tweak the low RPM slope of the idle timing graph up so it would recover properly. (more timing down low) and tweak the upper end slope to prevent oscillation.

I still need to install an idle air valve of some sort to test all the fancy idle improvements.
It works ~perfect for me just using the idle timing.
Always doing things the hard way, MS2 sequential w/ v1.01 mainboard, LS2 coils. 80 mile/day commuter status.
piledriver
Super MS/Extra'er
 
Posts: 1103
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2009 6:24 am
Location: Van Alstyne, Texas

PreviousNext

Return to MS2/Extra Development

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests