Who wants to school me! :)

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Who wants to school me! :)

Postby hamish_18 » Fri Apr 13, 2012 11:21 am

So everything seems to be coming together on my turbo build. A couple of the things I have been wanting to change is to use more mapDOT, and to go to closed loop idle.

I have enabled these and things SEEM to be fairly stable. I still have a little hesitation from leaning out at just off idle. but I thought I would throw up a log and my tune to see if anybody wants to take a look at it, and offer any suggestions.

Specs are:
99 toyota tacoma 2rz-fe with wasted spark, and semi-seq injection.
MS3 pcb 3.0, with mainboard only.

Thanks,
Chris
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*EDIT help with lean off idle condition.

Postby hamish_18 » Mon Apr 16, 2012 8:59 am

Really? Nobody wants to take the bait?? :)

At any rate, I am getting frustrated a little. I can't seem to get rid of the off idle lean issue.. It's really really apparent when the truck is cold. It doesn't really go away when I add or take away warm-up enrichment or messing with the AE.. Also I have a wide fluctuation in AFR's while cruising. it will go from 12's to 18's in a matter of seconds. When my rpm's aren't changing really. Maybe less than 100 rpms while cruising. I can post up a log of it, but I really need to figure this out.

Regards,
hamish_18
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Re: Who wants to school me! :)

Postby Matt Cramer » Mon Apr 16, 2012 10:44 am

For some reason, it's been set to run a massive amount of idle advance, up to 51.2 degrees. I'd turn the idle advance off.

Also looks like you probably need a bit more AE at low throttle movement amounts.
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Re: Who wants to school me! :)

Postby hamish_18 » Mon Apr 16, 2012 11:32 am

So even more AE? that tune is out dated now. I ended up changing the ratio to 50%, and changed the values around a bit for the mapdot. so you suggest to turn idle advance completely off? or just change the idle advance down some. And what would your suggestions be for AE? I have read what information is there for AE, but still don't understand it completely.

Regards,
Chris Hay
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Re: Who wants to school me! :)

Postby hamish_18 » Mon Apr 16, 2012 11:34 am

I am heading to lunch. So I will get a current log, and tune for ya.
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Re: Who wants to school me! :)

Postby hamish_18 » Mon Apr 16, 2012 1:27 pm

Okay here is my current tune, and a data log. I added a little more AE, and changed my idle advance down as you suggested. Do I need even more AE yet???
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Re: Who wants to school me! :)

Postby pit_celica » Mon Apr 16, 2012 7:13 pm

Where is located your wideband sensor? Is it very far off the cylinder head? Because it's like there is a large delay between a PW spike and the wideband reading rich.

I would try to lenghten the AE PW spike by setting the Accel time and Accel taper time something higher. You may need to decrease your PW adder% vs TPSdot curve after doing it.

Also, I think you should try EAE. It's a little hard to understand at first, but once you got it, it's doing some miracle. My AFR is now nearly flat even when playing with the throttle wildly. Here's a useful thread to understand how to tune EAE :

viewtopic.php?p=185966#p185966

For your idle, it now seems solid. Maybe a tad rich, but RPM wise, it seems fine.

Sam
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Re: Who wants to school me! :)

Postby hamish_18 » Mon Apr 16, 2012 10:16 pm

Hi Sam,

Thanks for the input. My WB is located at pretty much the end of the downpipe. Here is a pic of the downpipe:
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid= ... permPage=1

I think my idle is better now. Since going to closed loop I have had a much more stable idle. I also adjusted my throttle cable to allow my ICV to not be at such a high PWM %.

I understand what you are saying. It seems like MS is playing 'catch-up' all the time. But I figured that the location I chose wasn't to far away. I guess I could move it if I had to. But I really don't if I can tune around it...

I will read over your thread tomorrow, and see what I can learn about it. Sorry about being a noob with this part of the tuning, but I don't really understand what you mean by this:
"You may need to decrease your PW adder% vs TPSdot curve after doing it."

I really appreciate your help though! Once I can get this last part done I think it's ready for the dyno! :)
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Re: Who wants to school me! :)

Postby pit_celica » Tue Apr 17, 2012 5:35 am

I will read over your thread tomorrow, and see what I can learn about it. Sorry about being a noob with this part of the tuning, but I don't really understand what you mean by this:
"You may need to decrease your PW adder% vs TPSdot curve after doing it."


This is because if you lengthen the Accel PW time, then, maybe alot of fuel will be injected for a longer time. Now, you've tuned it so that a big PW spike happen on accel. I'm suggesting you to reduce the amplitude of the spike (by decreasing the PW adder % vs TPSdot curve in the Accel Wizard) and increasing the lenght of the spike. Then, the same amount of fuel will be injected, but in a less spiky way.

But, this is if you want to use AE only. If you use EAE, turn-off traditionnal AE by setting the MAPdot and TPSdot thresholds very high. It will be easier to tune EAE.

For the distance of the O2 sensor, I would like to see where this downpipe is located from the cylinder head (long turbo manifold runner?).

Sam
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Re: Who wants to school me! :)

Postby hamish_18 » Tue Apr 17, 2012 7:11 am

the mani is pretty short. here is another shot I think that will help you:
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid= ... =3&theater

Hmm I thought I had a shot from the side with the downpipe on. But that shows the mani and the turbo.
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Re: Who wants to school me! :)

Postby hamish_18 » Tue Apr 17, 2012 8:02 am

New tune, and data log of drive to work today :) I altered the AE numbers, and it may be getting better? It still stumbled pretty badly at the beginning of the log though.

Regards,
Chris
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Re: Who wants to school me! :)

Postby pit_celica » Tue Apr 17, 2012 8:54 am

At the beginning of the log, the throttle movement was too slow so the accel event did not happen. Try to lower the TPSdot and the MAPdot threshold a small bit. Do not lower it too much so that too small TPS movement will trigger unwanted accel events. I would increase the Accel time a little more too (like 0.8s).

Sam
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Re: Who wants to school me! :)

Postby hamish_18 » Tue Apr 17, 2012 12:39 pm

well I changed that number to 1.0 and it didn't really make a difference :( Reading about EAE right now....
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Re: Who wants to school me! :)

Postby hamish_18 » Fri Apr 27, 2012 1:31 pm

Just to let you guys know, I am still having the lean condition issues. It really sucks for starting out. But I have been to busy to get logs, etc.. over to the thread. I will try to soon.
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